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Effect of maximalist running shoes on ground reaction forces

Discussion in 'Biomechanics, Sports and Foot orthoses' started by NewsBot, May 28, 2015.

  1. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Effect of Highly Cushioned Shoes on Ground Reaction Forces during Running
    Matthew Ruder, Phatarapon Atimetin, Erin Futrell, Irene Davis.
    Presented at the ACSM Meeting; San Diego May 2015
     
  2. Admin2

    Admin2 Administrator Staff Member

  3. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

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    The shoes used in the study were Hoka Stinsons.
     
  4. efuller

    efuller MVP

    There are studies that show that people change their running style on different surfaces. A cushioned shoe is a different surface. On harder surfaces people tend to flex their knee more to create a less stiff spring at contact. There are probably higher internal forces with more knee flexion.

    Then there is the problem that there is not much correlation between impact forces and injury.

    Peoples knees might feel better if the internal forces are lower and choose a shoe with more cushioning. Hence the sales data.
    Just theorizing
    Eric
     
  5. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

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    indeed... one study even linked higher impacts to less injuries!
     
  6. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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  7. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

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    Very first sentence:
    What manufacturers are claiming that? They just making that up.
     
  8. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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  9. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

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    I just went checking on some of the fan boy communities for their take on this study... highly amusing. ... they just don't do science very well at all!

    Not one of them is condemning the sample size of 5 (in the abstract) or 14 (in the final presentation); yet when they see a study they don't like they ridicule sample sizes like that ... go figure!
     
  10. William Fowler

    William Fowler Active Member

    From that article
    Does there own data show that this does not happen? The impacts from the Hoka were the same as from the traditional shoe, so they are not slamming the foot down.
     
  11. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

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    Good catch; that is indeed the case and their own data shows it. The fan boys also missed that as well!
     
  12. Consider the source. Irene Davis has been a barefoot running advocate for many years and told me that the goal of her practice is to get all of her patients out of orthotics.

    Whatever...

    I believe the data shows that the impact loading rates are greater in barefoot running than in running shoes. We don't even know if impact forces are the cause of running injuries or not! My guess that most running injuries are caused by repetitive levels of higher magnitudes of internal moments, not impact forces.
     
  13. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

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    BTW, the "traditional running shoe" used in the study was the Nike Air Pegasus.

    ...which means they compared a cushioned running shoe to a cushioned running shoe and the cushioned running shoe did not reduce impacts forces compared to a cushioned running shoe ... go figure!
     
  14. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

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    Just to clarify on the sample size of the study. The abstract as submitted for the conference only had 5 subjects due to timelines and deadlines of abstract submissions. At the conference they presented the data on 14 subjects. In the Medscape article linked above is the data from the 14 ... it is not really any different to the data on the 5 in the abstract.

    Is 14 adequate? I guess that depends if you like the results of the study! I did notice in one fan boy group that they are having wet dreams over this study. Not once is anyone criticizing the sample size, yet in that group they regularly condemn other studies with bigger sample sizes just because they don't like the results .... go figure!

    I do not have a problem with the sample size .... even though it is on the smaller side. It is a within subjects design (ie subjects act as their own controls) and you can get away with a smaller group in these types of designs. If you look at the data for the 5 subjects and then the 14 subjects, there is no hint of a trend or any differences. What is a larger study size going to show?
     
  15. David Smith

    David Smith Well-Known Member

  16. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Well-Known Member

    Aloha,

    Craig you are a Rational Genius and a honored member of the No Dah Delegation.

    "...which means they compared a cushioned running shoe to a cushioned running shoe and the cushioned running shoe did not reduce impacts forces compared to a cushioned running shoe ... go figure!"


    I think we are missing an important research concept.

    The inside verses outside of the shoe measurements.

    Doing an instrumented treadmill analysis is great if you want the data after it has been modified by the subject shoe system. WE ARE READING THROUGH FOAM.

    We should try to limit comparing one shoe vs another and test more what the shoe does as it contacts the ground and body separately. strange but simple. Then compare the systems.

    We need inside and outside shoe data to compare the true results of the shoe system and not to just compare it to another similar shoe.

    But we do not do that very well and the advanced testing systems to do this are still in their infancy and are being developed by a few renegades.

    A hui hou,
    Steve

    Why is Podiatry Arena again headlining this article as maximalism whereas the authors did not?

    Maximalism must prove significant quantifiable improvements in protection, energy efficiency, stability, and greenability.


    This is not maximalism it is super sizing foam shoes.
     
  17. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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  18. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Arthur, K. Kinetic and kinematic comparison ofHOKA shoes to standard running shoes.
    MS in Clinical Exercise Physiology, December 2015, 52pp. (J. Porcari)
     
  19. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Does maximalist footwear lower impact loading during level ground and downhill running?
    Zoe Y. S. Chan et al
    European Journal of Sport Science : 24 May 2018
     
  20. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Well-Known Member

    Aloha,
    It would have been cool and groovy had they also used acelerometers on the shins and lower backs of the subject while running on the downhill pressure map treadmill.
    How else do you really find out what the shoe-orthotic systems are doing.
    They read through all that thick foam again and then assumed that is what the body felt?

    Maximialism must show significant and testable improvements in stability, protection, energy efficiency and greenability.
    It is the Inverse of Minimalism. and not just in size and shape please.

    Mahalo,
    Steve

    For those of you in the countdown to graduations in the study of the mechanics of human movement and ambulation
    "Your the Rockenist Cats in Galaxy"!

     
  21. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Effect of the cushioning running shoes in ground contact time of phases of gait
    AndreaRoca-Dolsa et al
    Journal of the Mechanical Behavior of Biomedical Materials
    Volume 88, December 2018, Pages 196-200

     
  22. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

    Articles:
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    Shoe cushioning affects lower extremity joint contact forces during running
    Stacey A. Meardon et al
    Footwear Science: 16 Nov 2018
     
  23. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Comparison of in-shoe plantar loading forces between minimalist and maximalist cushion running shoes
    Jena Kay Ogston
    Footwear Science : 12 Feb 2019
     
  24. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    A 6-Week Transition to Maximal Running Shoes Does Not Change Running Biomechanics.
    Hannigan JJ, Pollard CD
    Am J Sports Med. 2019 Mar;47(4):968-973
     
  25. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    NEWS RELEASE 16-APR-2019
    Despite transition period, maximal running shoes may still increase risk of injury
    [​IMG]
    IMAGE: A RUNNER WEARS MAXIMAL SHOES IN THE FORCE LAB AT OSU-CASCADES. view more
    CREDIT: ROB KERR/OSU-CASCADES
    BEND, Ore. - A six-week transition period did not help wearers adjust to "maximal" running shoes, indicating that increased impact forces and loading rates caused by the shoe design do not change over time, a new study from Oregon State University - Cascades has found.
    The shoes, which feature increased cushioning, particularly in the forefoot region of the midsole, affect runners' biomechanics, leaving them at increased risk of injury, said Christine Pollard, director of the Bend campus's Functional Orthopedic Research Center of Excellence (FORCE) Lab and a co-author of the study.
    "These shoes may work for certain people, but right now we just don't know who they are good for," said Pollard, an associate professor of kinesiology at OSU-Cascades. "The findings suggest that people aren't really changing the way they run in the shoes, even after a six-week transition, potentially leaving them at increased risk of injury."
    The study was published recently in the American Journal of Sports Medicine. The lead author is J.J. Hannigan, a post-doctoral researcher in the FORCE Lab.
    Maximal shoes have been growing in popularity since being introduced in 2010. More than 20 varieties of maximal shoes are on the market, but little research has been conducted on the shoes to understand their effect on running biomechanics. Controlled studies, like the research at the FORCE Lab, help clinicians make science-based recommendations to runners.
    Researchers in the FORCE Lab previously conducted a study of people running in the shoes before and after a 5K treadmill run; the findings from that study suggested that the maximal shoes may increase impact force and loading rates, which indicate a greater risk of injury.
    The new study was designed to build on the previous research and see how a six-week transition to the maximal shoe might affect runners' biomechanics.
    "We wanted to look beyond any novelty effect the shoe might have," Pollard said. "It's a very new area and we have a lot of work to do to understand how these shoes affect running mechanics."
    The researchers studied 20 runners, a mix of men and women, between the ages of 18 and 45, who ran at least 15 miles a week. The runners participated in two biomechanical testing sessions in the lab, each session about six weeks apart. They completed a series of running trials wearing maximal shoes and also wearing traditional running shoes.
    After the first testing session, the runners received a maximal shoe transition schedule to follow. They continued their regular running mileage but gradually increased the percent of their mileage run in the maximal shoe over the six-week period, with the last two weeks only in the maximal shoes.
    The results showed there were no changes in running mechanics over time in either type of shoes. The study did show increased impact forces and loading rates in the maximal shoe, supporting results of the earlier study. There was no difference in those biomechanics after the transition to the maximal shoes.
    "The concern in the maximal shoes is that you have this mass you're repeatedly loading. How are you attenuating that?" Pollard said. "We also saw changes in ankle kinematics, or the angular movement in the joints. With the maximal shoes we saw prolonged eversion, which likely increases stress on the legs and could lead to injury."
    More research is needed to understand how maximal shoes affect biomechanics, Pollard said. For now, runners and clinicians who work with runners should be cauti
    "We really don't know enough to be recommending them," said Pollard, who also is a licensed physical therapist. "If someone is going to try them out, I would suggest they try them out on a treadmill at a running store to see how they feel. How they feel then is how they'll feel in six weeks."
     
  26. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

    Articles:
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    Impact Of Footwear On Running Mechanics In Older
    Individuals: A Pilot Study

    Brianne Borgia, Kara N. Razak, Julia Freedman Silvernail.
    ACSM ANNUAL MEETING
    May 28 – June 1, 2019 – Orlando, Florida

     
  27. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Differences in running biomechanics between a maximal, traditional, and minimal running shoe
    J.J. Hanniganlow et al
    Journal of Science and Medicine in Sporthttps://www.jsams.org/article/S1440-2440(19)30473-6/fulltext
     
  28. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Do maximalist shoes mitigate risk factors for tibial stress fractures better than stability or flexible (marketed as minimalist) shoes?
    Jenny Tavares et al
    Footwear Science: 10 Jan 2020
     
  29. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Biomechanical analysis of two runners who developed leg injuries during a six-week transition to maximal running shoes: A case series
    J. J. Hannigan &Christine D. Pollard
    Journal of Sports Sciences: 01 Jun 2021
     
  30. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Effects of Maximalist vs. Minimalist Shoes on Kinematic and Kinetic Variables
    Nicholas Pekmezian, Matthew Schrager, Jessica Cosgrove, Nicholas Smith, Marc Kagan, Marcini Thomas
    14 May 2021 https://doi.org/10.1096/fasebj.2021.35.S1.03759
     
  31. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Leg and Joint Stiffness Adaptations to Minimalist and Maximalist Running Shoes
    Allison H. Gruber et al
    Journal of Applied Biomechanics 19 Jul 2021
     
  32. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Effect of Footwear on Running Impact Loading in the Preschool
    Years

    Jan Plesek et al
    Source
     
  33. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Acute effects of footwear on running impact loading in the preschool years
    Jan Plesek et al
    Sports Biomechanics 04 Apr 2022
     
  34. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    The Effect of Maximalist Running Shoes on Impact Loading: A Critically Appraised Topic
    in International Journal of Athletic Therapy and Training

    Janice K. Loudon PT, PhD, ATC and Marcie Swift PT, PhD
    26 Apr 2022
     
  35. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Running Footwear and Impact Peak Differences in Recreational Runners
    Federico Roggio et al
    Biology 2022, 11(6), 818; https://doi.org/10.3390/biology11060818
     
  36. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Running Footwear and Impact Peak Differences in Recreational Runners
    Federico Roggio et al
    Biology (Basel). 2022 May 26;11(6):818
     
  37. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Shock Acceleration and Attenuation during Running with Minimalist and Maximalist Shoes: A Time- and Frequency-Domain Analysis of Tibial Acceleration
    Liangliang Xiang et al
    Bioengineering 2022, 9(7), 322
     
  38. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Maximalist Shoes: Separating Science From Hype
    Justin C Haghverdian, Andrew R Hsu
    Foot Ankle Spec. 2023 Dec 20
     
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