Welcome to the Podiatry Arena forums

You are currently viewing our podiatry forum as a guest which gives you limited access to view all podiatry discussions and access our other features. By joining our free global community of Podiatrists and other interested foot health care professionals you will have access to post podiatry topics (answer and ask questions), communicate privately with other members, upload content, view attachments, receive a weekly email update of new discussions, access other special features. Registered users do not get displayed the advertisements in posted messages. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our global Podiatry community today!

  1. Have you considered the Clinical Biomechanics Boot Camp Online, for taking it to the next level? See here for more.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Have you considered the Clinical Biomechanics Boot Camp Online, for taking it to the next level? See here for more.
Dismiss Notice
Have you liked us on Facebook to get our updates? Please do. Click here for our Facebook page.
Dismiss Notice
Do you get the weekly newsletter that Podiatry Arena sends out to update everybody? If not, click here to organise this.

Foot orthotics "Outside your scope of practice as a registered Podiatrist"

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by NewsBot, Sep 19, 2011.

  1. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

    Articles:
    1

    Members do not see these Ads. Sign Up.
    HPC Complaint:
    http://www.hpc-uk.org/complaints/hearings/index.asp?id=2391&showAll=1
     
  2. Griff

    Griff Moderator

    I agree with plagiarism being a very real issue.

    However, have I read correctly that the HPC believe the provision of foot orthoses is outside of the scope of practice of a Podiatrist???
     
  3. Rob Kidd

    Rob Kidd Well-Known Member

    As always one must not mix issues.

    1) plagiarism is fraud, and is against the law
    2) Orthotics (for foot & ankle) are NOT outside the scope of the podiatrist
     
  4. Griff

    Griff Moderator

    It seems the HPC may have a different opinion to this...
     
  5. Rob Kidd

    Rob Kidd Well-Known Member

    Then it is time they were educated appropriately, and took the correct advise. That is not to say, or course, that other professions may also have those skills - eg an orthotist.
     
  6. Ian Drakard

    Ian Drakard Active Member

    It would not be the first time I've seen pending complaints listed in this style by the HPC before a hearing, and then seen them thrown out by the hearing.

    Does anyone know enough about the complaints/hearings process to explain how the complaint in 3a would get to this stage? While I'm sure it will get thrown out when it gets to hearing, I'm slightly concerned to be regulated by a body that doesn't appear to know what we do!
     
  7. Orthican

    Orthican Active Member

    It seems the podiatric associations in the UK need to have a sit down with the insurance companies. Pain in the buttocks dealing with bean counters and teaching them about yourselves but well worth the effort. We always select a team to do this so there is good representation for all.
     
  8. Catfoot

    Catfoot Well-Known Member

    All,
    I was a bit puzzled when I first read these allegations.

    However, I think it is fair to say that anything in the HPC Standards of Proficiency for Chiropodists can be outside an individual Chiropodist's Scope of Practice if they have not been adequately trained in the techniques required. eg LA.

    Stephen Gardiner claims to be an expert in orthotics/biomechanics and states he has trained with a Profesor Jourdain in France.

    http://www.afootabove.co.uk/About_Us.htm


    I have never heard of this professor, but maybe someone else has?

    regards

    Catfoot
     
  9. davidh

    davidh Podiatry Arena Veteran

  10. Phil Wells

    Phil Wells Active Member

    The french professor may be linked to SIDAS insoles which Mr Gardiner provides.
    I do have a certain bias here as I take exception to his statement on his website that he has the leading practice in Beesto etc - especially as my wife's (which I also work part time at) and my Father in laws practices are within spitting distance of his Beeston practice.
    I thought it was against SOCAP advertising guidelines to state to be better than other members but what do I know.

    Phil
     
  11. Catfoot

    Catfoot Well-Known Member

    Phil,
    You are correct when you say

    as it contravenes the SCP Code of Ethics. It is also both a Trading Standards and an Advertising Standards Offence to make such claims if they cannot be proven.

    regards

    Catfoot
     
  12. Agreed. What appears to have happened here is within the context of the medical report rather than copying and pasting from the internet. Again we are not privy to all the facts in this instance, but with medical reports the expert will first have to digest all previous expert opinions - sometimes from colleagues within the same profession, then offer their own views and opinions. Sometimes they differ; sometimes they will agree. As the expert is essentially providing a court with their opinion, said opinion should be clear, concise and grammatically correct. As such there may be times you will use similar terms or the same phrase to describe your findings; this is not plagerism but unavoidable coincidence. That said, copying another expert's report and offering it as your own is another matter altogether!
     
  13. davidh

    davidh Podiatry Arena Veteran

    This may be the real crux of the matter.
    It should be remembered that even if a case does not reach court a high proportion of medico-legal reports are eventually examined in fine detail - by the instructing solicitor, barrister, and other medico-legal experts. Even if the defendant has admitted liability a case can drag on for years before completion, giving ample opportunity for someone to look at a report and pick up inconsistencies.
     
  14. Very true, David - something worth remembering for anyone considering undertaking this kind of work. I wonder if the court has already rested in this matter and whether the referral to the HPC complaints was made under the direction of the judge or whether it was raised by the solicitor?
     
  15. footnannie

    footnannie Member

    This is the first time I have commented on Pod Arena ...so please be gentle with me or I may not come back!
    I perceive the issue here is not whether a Pod may, with sufficient training, fit orthotics. That is an understood part of our 'scope' as recognised by the HPC.
    The issue is the validity of Mr Gardiner's training in comparison with his claims, coupled with the alleged plagiarism.
    Rene Jourdain is a tutor at Sidas, France, where Sidas provide a 2/3 day course on the fitting and manufacture of their insoles, which is the course Mr Gardiner took. Prof Jourdain does not teach Biomechanics so their is no such 'qualification' as Mr Gardiner claims to hold.
    There is also a concurrent hearing for several cases of probable fraud on insurance claims by Mr Gardiner so it seems there may be more to this whole issue than is apparent on first reading

    'Some talk the talk, some walk the walk, but very few can do both at the same time'
     
  16. footnannie

    footnannie Member

    You see now why I haven't posted a reply on any subject before now. I killed that one stone dead, didn't I?
    Just as well I'm a lot better than that with my patients.
    PS Sorry for incorrect usage of 'their' when it should have been 'there'
    Don't think I'll try this again! :(

    'Some talk the talk, some walk the walk, but very few can do both at the same time'
     
  17. blinda

    blinda MVP


    Au contraire. The `thanks` you received would indicate otherwise. Your post was both informative and polite. I can`t comment on the allegations in this case as I know Mr Gardiner personally.

    Stick around, there`s much to learn and offer here. We can always do with new flesh.

    Cheers,
    Bel
     
  18. footnannie

    footnannie Member

    Thanks for that Belinda
    May try again at some point in the future then
     
  19. admin

    admin Administrator Staff Member

    The complaint at the HPC has been amended and the orthotic claims have been removed.
    The complaint is now only on the plagarism issue:
     
  20. gaittec

    gaittec Active Member

    'Some talk the talk, some walk the walk, but very few can do both at the same time'

    And, I can chew gum at the same time. ;)
     
  21. footnannie

    footnannie Member

    Where is your totally impartial, evidence - based and wholly irrefutable study for that???!!!
     
  22. davidh

    davidh Podiatry Arena Veteran

    That in itself is not only dishonest, but illegal in the context of a medico-legal report.
    Civil Procedure Rule Part 35 clearly states that the expert witness's first duty is not to the instructing solicitor, or other party, but to the Court. If true the perpetrator could not only be had for perjury, but could also receive a substantial fine for wasting Court time.

    I for one sincerely hope the HPC have this one spectacularly wrong.
     
  23. gaittec

    gaittec Active Member

    [​IMG]

    Obviously I am equipped to do all three.
     
  24. Catfoot

    Catfoot Well-Known Member

    All,
    I was just wondering that, as Mr Gardiner is a member of both the SCP and the Institute, which professional body will be defending him in this hearing ? :confused:

    regards

    Catfoot
     
  25. footnannie

    footnannie Member

    I don't think that either the SCP or IOCP defend their members directly. I understand that it is the insurance with those professional bodies that covers legal help,advice and representation at HPC hearings.
     
  26. Catfoot

    Catfoot Well-Known Member

    You are quite correct, footnannie.

    What I meant to say was I wonder which organisation he will go to for help?

    The IOCP could find the whole business rather embarassing, especially as they voted him in as their treasurer. They could try to distance themselves from him.

    regards

    Catfoot
     
  27. footnannie

    footnannie Member

    Don't think so as they chose to ignore the possibility that many of his qualification / experience claims were somewhat 'economical with the truth'. They will just lie low until it has blown over. Similar to some Politicians, maybe?
     
  28. Catfoot

    Catfoot Well-Known Member

  29. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

    Articles:
    1
    Plagiarism is very serious
     
  30. Catfoot

    Catfoot Well-Known Member

  31. footnannie

    footnannie Member

    Sadly Mr Gardiner's many other 'misdemeanours' now probably will never come to light but at least some justice has seen to be served.
    However his being struck-off then leads to the question of where his staff ( as he has 4 clinics) stand over continuing to work for him. The FHP may be ok as presumably the registering bodies do not have any clauses covering such a scenario. But how about the Registered Pods? Are they now in contravention of HPC Standards? And could they find themselves in the unfortunate position of being called before the HPC?
     
  32. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

    Articles:
    1
    Press Release from the HPC:
    Chiropodist struck off for fraud
     
  33. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

    Articles:
    1
    The Ilkeston Advertiser are reporting:
    Struck off health worker keeps job
    Full story
     
  34. cyril20th

    cyril20th Member

    As a former SMAE member. We did not have this problem, we could seek advice from them. if that did not fit the case. Then a trip up to the Institute and a consultation there.The consultant there was an orthopedic surgeon. We were never left in the dark
     
Loading...

Share This Page