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Which Racing Flats?

Discussion in 'Biomechanics, Sports and Foot orthoses' started by manmantis, Jun 16, 2011.

  1. manmantis

    manmantis Active Member


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    Hi,

    I had a visit from a long-standing patient today. He's a fanatical triathlon/Iron Man competitor and has just qualified for this year's World's in Hawaii. His intention is "to go pro next year". :eek:

    He asked me today about racing flats, as he's now looking at reducing the weight of his shoes "to lose an extra 10th or two" in running times. He was given a pair of Mizuno flats to wear recently and developed "shin splints" after one training session (I'm not going into his biomechanics, that's another discussion). He's still keen to pursue this avenue however.

    Now, to me, most of these types of shoe are pretty insubstantial (I guess that's the point) and pretty similar in function (bar a little in heel-to-toe pitch, and cushioning). I've never run in a pair though.

    Without really wanting this to become a barefoot/minimalist discussion, what do people here advise as far as racing flats are concerned? What would be the key features to consider? What are the better styles around, and why?

    Cheers

    Julian
     
  2. manmantis

    manmantis Active Member

    By the way. Has anyone read the Wikipedia page on racing flats?:wacko:
     
  3. I used to wear ASICS DS racers. These are a racing shoe with a dual density midsole.
     
  4. Griff

    Griff Moderator

    Triathlete doing well. Triathlete qualifies for World Championships in Hawaii. Triathlete tries racing flats in order to shave off a questionable amount of time from his PB. Triathlete develops exercise induced leg pain after one session in new shoes. Triathlete still keen to pursue avenue of racing flats...

    Gotta love triathletes.

    I'm a DS racer man myself, as you already know. Cracking shoe.
     
  5. Julian:

    Honestly, I would never recommend just one or two racing flats to any runner without them going to the running shoe store to try them on and run in them. Tell your triathlete patient that even though minimizing shoe mass is important in a race situation, it is even more important to find a shoe that is comfortable and doesn't cause injury. Better to be in a slightly thicker soled shoe that has a slightly higher heel height differential than to wear the lightest, thinner shoe if this lighter shoe causes metatarsalgia or a metatarsal stress fracture during the race. Here is a racing flat from 1972 (when I first started racing road races) that was as thin and light as was available at the time. However, I would never race in this shoe on the roads since it was just too thin to be comfortable for me. Your best bet is to send him to a good running shoe store that has a good selection of racing flats and have him try each of them on and run in each of them for a few minutes.
     

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  6. Jonathan

    Jonathan Active Member

    ha Racing Flats - just trying to elbow in on the minimalists market :)
     
  7. RobinP

    RobinP Well-Known Member

    Does he use any orthoses in his runners?
     
  8. efuller

    efuller MVP

    The key feature... They don't hurt when you run in them... to sum up the advice given so far. Feet are different. Different feet will do better in different shoes. The trick is knowing which features go with which foot. Think STJ axis location amongst other things.

    Eric
     
  9. Dana Roueche

    Dana Roueche Well-Known Member

    I'm totally amazed that the guy is that accomplished and is still looking for a racing flat that works for him. Since he will be spending thousands on his trip to Hawaii, has probably spent thousands qualifying and thousands on his bike, I would think he could spend a few bucks actually trying a few running shoe options.

    Running for a few minutes in a pair of shoes in front of the running shoe store might help him come up with a short list of shoes. There is no way he would be able to tell how a pair of shoes are going to feel at mile 20 of marathon by running in them for a few minutes in the store.

    He needs to select possibly 5 or 6 viable alternatives and take each of them on a 20 to 25 mile run on pavement. Based on that, he will be in a much better position to determine which pair works the best for him and that should be the pair he runs his next race in. At $80 to $100 per pair, he is looking at a $500 investment. Considering what it is going to ultimately cost him for his Iron man Hawaii experience, it's a good investment.

    I now currently own and run in 14 active pairs of running shoes and wouldn't think twice about buying a new pair of shoes to test them out. For that matter, the last time I bought or even tried on a pair of running shoes in a retail store was 8 or 9 years ago. I just buy my shoes from internet stores where there is a complete selection of available models. I'll run in a pair of shoes for several hundred miles before basing my opinion on whether the shoe works or not.

    Dana
     
  10. RobinP

    RobinP Well-Known Member

    Wow! 14 pairs of trainers.

    When I was young and my parents had no money(feeling a 4 Yorkshiremen sketch coming on), I used to get teased, in a playful manner, at school for my trainers.

    Whilst all my friends wore Puma Oceana or other branded trainers, I was wearing "Nicks Nabs"

    Nicks - the brand of trainer
    Nabs - as in nabbed(Scottish slang for stolen) from the baskets outside Shoe Fayre.

    2 Questions

    1. Does anyone else remember the baskets of shoes outside Shoe Fayre
    2. Is anyone else scarred by their experience of wearing Nicks trainers as a youngster. If you were, don't worry, there is a facebook page for it. Don't make me wear Nicks Mum


    Here is a fine example of Nicks Nabs trainers. The great irony is that they are now considered retro and quite cool. I was clearly ahead of my time

    Anyway just remeniscing!

    Robin (not bitter) P
     
  11. Rybyrne

    Rybyrne Welcome New Poster

    Hi Manmantis,

    If he needs extra support in a light shoe the ds trainer is a good option as it is very light and essentially a lower profiled 2160. The brooks st racer is also very light with rearfoot support but very soft in the forefoot. Another option is the mizuno wave elixr. It is firmer very light and supportive for a race shoe. My guess is he is in Ronins at the moment so add an orthotic if he wants to stay in them, in saying that I wouldnt recommend he race an ironman in a sprint/olympic dist shoe.
    A mizuno wave precision with an orthotic would be a great option as again it is a firmer density and would most likely rid him of his anterior leg pain. The new asics skyspeed is very similar to the precision, basically a ds trainer without the midfoot support, and a slightly firmer density (I think personally the ds is too soft in the forefoot and if the noosa wasnt so ugly it would be a much better shoe for what the ds trainer is marketed toward).
    Most of the pros run in a bigger shoe as in the back end of the marathon that extrasupport is essential and the most common thing seen with flats is forefoot pain starting about 20_30k.
    As the previous poster said comfort is number 1 but Ds traner noosa, precision elixr or skyspeed should fit a category of 'lighter'. I personally raced in 2140's and found them comfortable but would go for an elixr or skyspeed with an orthotic next time round.
    Hope that helps.
    Cheers.
     
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