Windlass Mechanism Enhancing Running Shoes

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We, generally, have two classes of running shoes:
1. Motion control/stability
2. Cushioning/shock absorption

Are the windlass mechanism enhancing type running shoes a third class or are they just 'design features'?

Remember the Brooks kinetic wedge from the late 80's? - that apparently got caught up in manufacturing quality control issues with Brooks prior to the bankruptcy in the late 80's (or was it early 90's?) and was discontinued.

Now we have on the market the ASIC's Empire, the Nike Structure Triax 8, and the soon to be released New Balance 1050 - they all approach the windlass enhancing concept differently with different design features - from our research each shoe appears to help different types of windlass dysfunctions.

Here is an abstract for one of my presentations at this weeks Sports Medicine NZ Conference:

Should these shoes be classified as a new class?
What say you?

 

From the 70's and 80's I remember the Brooks Kinetic wedge, the Hi-Tec "Key" system for adjusting motion stability, the Nike Equator (an early anti-pronation shoe), and the Addidas "Dellinger Web" (a shock absorbtion feature). As far as I am aware there was little if any published research to show how or if these systems worked, and to my mind they were more design features than proven "of benefit" systems.

Will a windlass mechanism enhancing shoe be sold by shoeshops, or prescribed by health professionals?
If the former then I guess the shoe incorporates a design feature (unless shoe salesmen know what FHL is, how to diagnose it and how to treat it ).
If the latter, then I suppose it could be considered a third class of shoe. As one of my old maths teachers used to say - "I see the result - where's the working-out"!.
Regards,
David

 

They are in the shops now!!! (Except the NB1050 ... but thats only a matter of days)

You are right re the issues ... we are flat out looking at what foot types do and do not respond to these design features (should have the data by the end of the year).... the next question is, if the retailers can be trained to "recognise" these foot types or not?; the bigger question is the potential for harm from these shoes if the foot does not need these design features? --- it could well be that they do not do any harm if the foot does not need them - the upside is the benefit to those that do need these types of design features.

Just today I had a couple of staff wear the ASIC's Empire and Nike Sructure 8 on their left foot and their nearest "non-windlass" equivalents (DS Trainer and Structure 7) on their right foot (will do the New Balance 1050 and 765's next week) -- both staff commented that both shoes made their feet function very differently ..... no doubt the shoes are doing something....

I recently did an orthoses prescribing workshop interstate and during the workshop sidetracked into talking about these running shoes .... afterwards I was approached by a Podiatrist there with the question "Why don't we know about these shoes?" ... the companies have a job to do here .... But so do the Podiatrists --- one company rep I dialogued with last week told me of an encounter with a Podiatrist over these shoes who was very scathing of the concept ... all I could say is that they were showing there ignornace and must have had their head in the sand for the last few years to not see what has been going on re this and these concepts....

Its more complicated than that .....

 

Agreed.
After all, Its a fairly simple thing to recognise a foot which needs cushioning, or a "loose" foot which needs motion stability. 1st MPJ dysfunction is something else entirely .

Regards,
David

 

Windlass trainers

Hopefully the shoe sales people will be reviewing their customers once they've sold them a pair of shoes that will alter the way they're running/walking. I recently had a patient who'd bought some Saucony anti-pronatory running shoes after reading an article in a running magazine. From contact through to propulsion the guy excessively pronates, yes, but he was asymptomatic before he bought the shoes. He presented with a palpable swollen mass 1-2cm distal to the medial calcaneal tubercle around the muscle belly of flexor hallucis brevis. The guy was in agony, any anti-pronatory device would make contact with the area and cause further problems. Conservatively, strapping and icing helped, but he's had a local corticosteroid injection to reduce the inflammation and we're seeing how it goes. I'm all for advances in running shoes, but education of shoe salesmen as to when to refer is of utmost importance.
Bob

 

Absolutely!
It all boils down to this - are shoe salesmen diagnosing and prescribing?
Cheers,
David H

 

windlass trainers

As an aside, Craig, are you testing the Nike 'free' 5.0 trainers as mentioned on a previous thread in the biomechanics forum? Funny looking shoe, wonder if it does exactly what it says on the tin? Nice website Nike have put together with lots of technical pictures like the 2D saggital plane motion analysis one in one of the videos. $84.99 they're charging to run barefoot. At that sort of money, you would have thought they'd have bought themselves a Vicon.
Bob

 

'functional' trainers

Earlier this year I decided to start doing some running for fitness, and rather than try with my clapped out old tennis trainers, I visited a recently opened specialist running shoe shop.

I was pleasantly surprised that the sales staff took time to perform (a fairly basic) biomech assessment including some assessment on their in-house treadmill. Time was also taken to discuss any injuries. I obviously explained that I was a Podiatrist and it transpired that prior to opening the shop, the manager had approached a local Pod who'd arranged some staff training. He was well informed and very pro-podiatry.

My concern is that how many shops go to this length to discuss/assess customers needs? If I visited one of the larger retail chains, possibly attracted by cheaper prices, I'm not certain any of this would be carried out. I've had experiences in the past when I've been trying to buy indoor football trainers from one of these outlets, only to be offered astro-turf trainers instead!

Alec.

 

I work closley with a running shoe retailer, the answer is david, i hope not!

However i feel it is worth while pointing out that just about all pods that work specifically in biomechanics (my only experience is private p) that i know of are superb at their jobs. e.g. make people pain free and able to return quickly with minimal occurance of symptoms.

But There are those that are not as good at observing biomechanical dysfunction as the specialist retailers. Which is a scary thought

I think, and it is only my opinion, that these specialists are good at selecting the correct shoe, in the majority of cases. And understand typical gait patterns and the visual outline of specific foot types to a certain degree, i find this helps me as people are passed along on a frequent basis

However, even those working closely with other therapists at hand, are in no way capable of determining pathomechanics. Let alone deciding what in the world to do about it. (well hope not, as i spend most of my days in learning mode )

Another point, probably over opinionated as usual, but i tend to view the correct shoe as an a general need, at the onset of a training programme. How this need and 'correctness' is gained, with a level of understanding, is not that obvious it seems , with the podiatrist and required referal pathways potentially involved at all stages of any programme, in contrast to only the start in providing a base requirement only. As with the footwear specialists.

kind regards all

 

Good point Steven .
Regards,
David

 

Running Shoe Stores

Colleagues:

Probably one of the smartest marketing tools that any sports minded podiatrist can use is to become friendly and "affiliated" with the best running or sports shoe store in their communities. I have been doing a "free-screening clinic" one Saturday a month (2 hours) at such a store here in Sacramento for the past 17+ years and this has not only increased the prominence and reputation of the store but has helped my practice immensely. Every new runner that comes to town that goes to this well-known running shoe store is told to go to me if they have a running injury. In addition, I send the store my patients for over-the-counter foot orthoses and shoes every day. This is a win-win situation for the podiatrist and the shoe store and its marketing effect and practice enhancement potential should not be underestimated.

 

I will bump this old thread, as have new info. Here are part of an abstract we just finished:

(much cut)

 

'Windlass' trainers

Hi Craig

Do you think the shoes you were supplied with could also be another expanation for the results obtained?

The Nike Structure has a duel density midsole, while the pegasus does not. The 765 (now the 766) is 'less controlling' than the 1050 in its contruction and the Asics DS Trainer is a 'race' shoe (more flexible lighter upper) with a lower heel height differential. Would this mean that the possibly increased reduction in pronation moments via the additional structural make up (not the windlass specific technology) of the 'windlass trainers' would infact reduce tension in the medial band of the plantar fascia (reverse windlass), compared with the 'non windlass trainers', and so allow easier initiation of the windlass?

I have close connections with my local running shop and they find these trainers great for some, but find occasionally the position of the higher density material can be too proximal and actually " inhibit the windlass mechanism by increasing force under the first ray" (their words not mine...isn't it great when we all speak the same way!).

Is there anybody out there with specific research on the effect of duel density midsoles on pronation velocity and lower limb kinematics etc?Or inshoe pressure results?

Paul Harradine MSc CertEd
Podiatrist / Director
The Podiatry and Chiropody Centre
Cosham, Portsmouth, UK

 

Getting back to this thread.
How do you know - Craig or anybody else - that a particular shoe is "Windlass Mechanism Enhancing" ? What are its features? What is by the way "windlass mechanism enhancing" ? What can we do to a feet to make its windlass mechanism work better ?

 

The three "windlass enhancing" running shoes we tested were chosed because the manufacturers claimed they had design features that would specficially enhance it. ie

Anything that facilitates first MPJ dorsiflexion, or more appropriatly 'reduces first MPJ dorsiflexion stiffness' could potentially be considered windlass enhancing.

 

Craig;
Simon Barthold (sp?) is here with us in the US at the APMA national scientific meeting. He was kind enough to attend our American Academy of Podiatric Sports Medicine shoe workshop this afternoon and referenced many upcoming changes in shoe technology coming in the next 5 years.

One thing he specifically said was coming was a shoe that essentially defies all traditional categrories, ie cushioned, stability, motion control. He said these shoes will couple the dorsiflexion of the forefoot to a stiffening mechanism that will cause the midfoot to be stiffer or rigid in late midstance and into propulsion. Before that the midsole will be much more compliant than todays current midfoot areas.

I'm not sure the shoes you are describing are what Simon was referring to, but I could be wrong.

Cheers!
Bruce

 

Simon and I have talked about this many a time and it is what its about. I am in the middle of searching several 1000 patents that are related to this topic .... interesting to see who has patented what ... will report back at a later date on what found.

BTW-Bruce - I have edited your signature, so its a clickable link rather than an unclickale url.

 

Here is one of those patents:

Link to patent

 

There were two at least that were somewhat similar on that page.
Great work Craig! Where is your patent?

Bruce