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Is there minimized interest in barefoot running?

Discussion in 'Biomechanics, Sports and Foot orthoses' started by NewsBot, Nov 7, 2012.

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  1. Mike and Craig:

    Don't you remember about trying to play chess with a rooster? It's simply not worth it.
     
  2. David Wedemeyer

    David Wedemeyer Well-Known Member

    Newsbot posted this just today, a Cochrane review:

    Rehabilitation for ankle fractures in adults.
    Lin CW, Donkers NA, Refshauge KM, Beckenkamp PR, Khera K, Moseley AM.

    Interesting, Blaise wouold have them healed in two weeks though. Where are your case studies Blaise, you're the one bucking the knowledge base and yet we have to take your word for it? ;) 4-6 immobilized is the recommendation. A fracture is a fracture, even a stress fracture right?
     
  3. drsha

    drsha Banned

    Craig:
    Apology Please!

    Your picture is that of the Terra Plana Store in London that was replaced with the Vivobarefoot Flagship store on Neal Street when they changed their name, which has now been remodeled.

    As a Vivobarefoot dealer marrying them with "barefoot training orthotic props" very successfully, I contacted them to let them know of how sad I was that the Gallahad Clark Empire had crumbled as per your innuendo.

    I am downloading a picture they sent me of their redesigned flagship store that reopened Sept 2012 in rebuttal.

    You have done nothing but reveal your bias and in publishing unfounded manipulative attacks that unfortunately have power because you skillfully represent yourself as professor, researcher and EBM guru as you intersperse unfounded lies based on no more evidence than your opinion against those who stand in the way of your biomechanical agenda.

    You IMHO, are no better than the zealots running in VFF's at moments like this.

    Please verify your facts in the future and render an apology for your rush to judgement regarding VivoBarefoot ASAP.

    Dennis
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Please consider these comments made from another thread from nearly two years ago where Dennis Shavelson accused me of "typing feet". Things haven't changed too much in two years, have they?

    http://www.podiatry-arena.com/podiatry-forum/showthread.php?t=59771&page=2

     
  5. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    Articles:
    8
    As such a Vivobarefoot fanboy, perhaps you could explain why they lied here. They get no sympathy from me. As I have always said:
     
  6. Blaise Dubois

    Blaise Dubois Active Member

    Don't worry Denis,
    The propaganda and church of BBS exist only inside the PA wall, one web site 'barefoot is bad' and some secret lab of BBS companies :dizzy:
     
  7. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    Articles:
    8
    Care to point out where I am promoting BBS's?


    ADDED: Just expanding on that and what I asked Dennis about. A study comes out that is retrospective on a small group (56) of almost elite level runners all wearing shoes that shows the heel strikers had 2x more injuries than the forefoot strikers. From that study, Vivobarefoot make the claim in a poster that this study proves that barefoot running is better.

    Do you agree with their claim that barefoot is better based on this retrospective study of almost elite level runners all wearing shoes?
    Should they not be held accountable for that claim?
    What has this do do with "The propaganda and church of BBS exist only inside the PA wall"? I see that as us not being gullible to fall for there claims.
     
  8. Blaise Dubois

    Blaise Dubois Active Member

    Not you specifically even if I think you will argue more against minimalism than maximalism. This Arena have a big philosophical bias about this barefoot and minimalism question... and are not very open mind about that... nothing about science.

    I have something against BBS... and it's because many promote it (pretty all the promotor of the BBS are in this Arena ;) ) by misuse, misrepresentation, misquoting and misinterpretation of the science... to support a lucrative business. You never comment on that the video of Simon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9pU1hMLP-E) but I think it's a good example.

    My other problem it's the politics back to all this shoe business (both side!). on that subject, do you think have time to publish the video you take of our 'debate/discussion' we did together in Melbourne?

    last question : Were you the guys in back of barefoot is bad? THAT'S propaganda! (I don't like the title)
     
  9. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    Articles:
    8
    Don't tarnish everyone here with the same brush.

    There is apparently a barefoot running forum that bans you if you say anything negative about barefoot running (I have not verified this, just read it on the RW forum). Assuming this is the case, are they not guilty of exactly what you are saying as well? Why do they not want to hear opposing views? No one gets banned here for opposing views unless they break the forum rules and a few are getting close. Everyone learns from it.
    I got bogged down editing it (ie inserting the powerpoint slides with questions over the video) - it is a bigger job than I thought. Its just a matter of finding time to finish it (we in end of semester exam making at the moment!)

    BTW, i edited by post above while you were repling:
    ADDED: Over at the Natural Running Center I recall reading a lengthy and detailed attempt to debunk the study that showed running in minimalist shoes was more economical than barefoot (sorry, don't have the links). I not sure that the debunking was successful or not, but what struck me was the lengths the author went to to discredit the study and that the same level of analysis or critical appraisal was not applied to other studies that supported minimalism on the blog. Why not do the same level of critical appraisal? Is that not just what you accused us of doing?
     
  10. drsha

    drsha Banned

    I think they have.

    I am less confrontational, much more reserved on The Arena and elsewhere.

    Articles are appearing that are consistent with FFTing and WB.

    I have reduced my comments regarding FFT and Wellness Biomechanics on threads that I don't generate.

    My science continue to grow thanks to many, including yourself, the barefooters and others.

    Sagittal and Transverse Plane Biomechanics is being utilized more as an alternative to RF Frontal Plane Biomechanics in practice.

    You and yours have not provided much recent important evidence, especially when it comes to clinical applications in practice. Valgus wedges for medial knee pain and a cadaver study on STJ Axis (any others?). Oh wait, I guess you're right.
    Some things never change, like your angry side.

    Dennis
     
  11. CraigT

    CraigT Well-Known Member

    Blaise- Care to comment further about the questions above regarding your 2-4 week healing program for MT stress fractures?? Or you going to just blip over them again...?

    I find the direction of this thread amusing- you have Blaise who does not acknowledge individualism arguing alongside Dennis whose principles are based on categorising individuals...
     
  12. Blaise Dubois

    Blaise Dubois Active Member

    ... and you bring nothing on the table.

    PS stress fracture MUST NOT be manage like complete fracture. On that topic, I feel I'm playing chest with chick... sorry to don't go further but it's very boring to speak with some of you... even my university first level students are more knowledgeable.

    More funny to speak about minimalism... just no more time for the next 3 weeks.
     
  13. I think we now need to get Ed Glaser and Brian Rothbart to join the superhero team of Blaise and Dennis to become....

    The Anti-Podiatry Arena Avengers!!:rolleyes:
     
  14. drsha

    drsha Banned

    That won't change the facts or the debate. Will it?

    Dennis
     
  15. Phil3600

    Phil3600 Active Member

    Why do you come PA on Blaise? I can't understand it nobody agrees with you and you're not skilled enough at debating to sound convincing plus I can't remember you ever sharing research. Stop wasting yours and everybody else's time. You must have better things to do with your time.

    For anyone who went to the Manchester summer school he is very similar to the physio who hijacked the entire Q&A session without asking a question just ranted at ASICS. All very selfish

    Please leave...
     
  16. CraigT

    CraigT Well-Known Member

    I guess that is a no... once again avoiding an answer. I have lost count the number of times now
     
  17. blinda

    blinda MVP


    Yep. All of the above, esp that in bold....and underlined.
     
  18. Phil3600

    Phil3600 Active Member

    I feel I should just let this go but I have just read this thread back and I think I spotted a slight contradiction by Blaise

    From post number 10 - tell him to come at quebec... we fix MTT stress fracture in 2-4 weeks... not with 6 month and surgery. Also in our province MTT stress fracture are rare and more than 30% of the population run on minimalist shoes

    From post number 22 - PS hundreds of case like that, great success!

    Hundreds of cases are rare?

    That's it I'm done.
     
  19. happens when people make it up as they go
     
  20. Blaise Dubois

    Blaise Dubois Active Member

    hoooooooooo
    Very good argument to support your point... very good to make the debate progress :sinking:

    After 15 years of practice with a specialty with runners and foot-knee problem, yes I saw hundreds of MTT stress fractures.

    With approx 100 000 runners in the area of Quebec city (more than 10 000 are serious runners and minimum 30% of them are running in minimalism), the incidence of MTT stress fracture on that population is A LOT less (relatively rare) compare to the stats we can read on systematic review (ex: Snyder-2006 : 15-20% of all Stress fracture, that represents +/-5% of the pathologies for runners and up to 30% for some track athlete and military personal) and other epidemiological study. AND YES, most of the one I was seeing was on BBS! Now we have more in minimalist shoe (too fast transition) but not more (I think less) in minimalist 'use to' than maximalist 'use too' have shoes

    What was your problem about my statements?:sinking:
    This was not a contradiction... but if you continue to search well you will find some contradictions... I hide 3 in all my posts in PA. If you find it you can have a piece of chocolate.:D
     
  21. Phil3600

    Phil3600 Active Member

    I thought you were talking sh*te. I've not changed my mind.

    Goodnight. Out from me.
     
  22. Blaise Dubois

    Blaise Dubois Active Member

    A. Exposing big bulky shoe runners for the nutters that they are (;) to Craig)
    B. Create a balance to an arena (or church) of BBS and orthotics promotion
    C. Make people realized they misuse, misrepresentation, misquoting and misinterpretation of the science (thanks Craig for the vocabulary)
    D. Changing a potentially armful practice based on a lucrative business more than an evidence based approach (20 000 000 000$ for the sport shoe and probably many billion for orthotics)
    E. Having fun to see how people protect their business... making politics... protect BBshoe companies (by hoping be hired one day;)?)
    F. learn some new concept and new thinking (I'm sad because now it's become more rare... ...)
    E. for MY PLEASURE : Know that I love PA because it's the last virtual place in the word where there is people that continue to think that it's normal that
    - BBS represent more that 90% of the market...
    - othotics is for ever
    - you need a surgery and 6 month of rest for a MTT stress fracture
    - barefoot is bad
    - compagnies do good research to proof that BBS are good for health
    - ...

    And you phil, why are you on PA? Because you have friends here? because you are Podiatrist? to learn? to Teach?... Very intriguing for me.

    Best
    Blaise
     
  23. admin

    admin Administrator Staff Member

    ...and on that note, this thread has run its course.
     
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