Potential surgical trainees cant be expected to do that!!

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A friend of mine just forwarded an email sent from the SCP faculty of Surgery regarding a recent surgery trainee post.

IT IS RIDICULOUS!!

So the post is spread between two units, fine. You have to work for free (honorary), not a surprise but fine.

The big problem is that the two units are in Dudley and Portsmouth!!
SO one week your expected to do Thursday & Friday in Portsmouth then the next week your expected to work Tuesday & Wednesday in Dudley.

Surely that is just excluding the majority of people who aren't rich enough to work around this schedule and travel that much, plus those with children.

Cheers

Simone

 

can't see the problem. Someone who is very dedicated and prepared to go to such lengths for a fixed period of time deserves the opportunity. Few training positions exist for this type of work, so it is to be grabbed with both hands.

 

I hope that neither an NHS department nor a consultant podiatric surgeon is guilty of using the grammatically incorrect and puzzling expressions "..work for free - and 'your' for 'you're'." If either party did so, then that would be a far better reason for avoiding the post than taking the trouble to travel between Dudley and Portsmouth.

Bill Liggins

 

its not me interested in the position, A colleague of mine sent it to me.
I am quite happy doing biomechanics in one place rather than travelling the country one week to the next (for free, and by this i mean working and not getting paid)

I have just given birth and as such would be automatically excluded from this post even if i wanted to because i couldn't possibley find child care to suit and actually afford to live.

W J Liggins, sorry for the errors. Just rather cross that our profession makes it so hard for these young aspiring podiatric surgeons, when the medical profession has a much better structured program for surgical training.

Simone

 

Any chance of posting the email to see how they describe it?

In my oppinion it is not that bad. It is only around a 2 hour drive between the places and as long as you are not expected to be in Portsmouth one day and then Dudley the next, although this is again possible but will result in a rather long day, then it is do-able albeit with a few logistical demands. It all depends on how much you want to become a surgeon and how much you are willing to work for it. If you wait for an opportunity to come knocking on your doorstep you may never get the chance to train.

 

its not just the travelling, what happens if you live in the north. Yes re-locating is not a vast issue, but where to relocate to and how are you going to build up private practice or find a compassionate nhs employer in the mean time. Remember you don't get paid for the post.

I don't think i have the email anymore. I think the app deadline expired a while ago.

Simone

 

Hello Simone,

Very nice to hear that one of my colleagues in biomechanics is concerned for the welfare of potential surgical trainees. Sadly, we don't live in a perfect world where all training posts are funded yet, but I am aware that the Faculty of Surgery are working towards this in the near future. Podiatric Surgery is still a relatively young profession and as such developments are continually being made in training and our practice. I am aware of adverts in the old Podiatry Association journals that offered training positions and experience in surgery units at a cost to the trainee. Thankfully, things have developed since then and the NHS does fund some training posts around the country.

The last point is an important one in explaining the situation you have presented. Unless the NHS Trust concerned has agreed to fund the training post in question, there is no method of reimbursing a trainee for their time. I am sure that all Consultants who are registered as surgical tutors would support and encourage their Trusts to aid in the development of a paid post, but we all know that NHS management and budgets are not entirely controlled by the clinicians .

Rather than postpone the possibility of training future podiatric surgeons, I am guessing the tutors involved have developed the post to get people through the system and create a larger profession. This is an issue that has been covered on a previous thread on this forum. Of course, it will take considerable dedication on the part of the student both geographically and academically, but nobody expects an easy ride when you head down the surgery route anyway. Personally, I was fortunate enough to have some funding for part of my pupillage. This was split between 2 centres (Manchester and Doncaster). I had to regularly leave home at half 5 to make it to Doncaster, work all day, study, sleep in really grotty hospital accommodation (with flea bites to prove it), repeat the next day and drive home (then work on all sorts of other things and do more study). I would say that I appreciated the 2 centre training method as I was exposed to a wider variety of surgery and was fortunate enough to work with some really talented surgeons and decent people.

Things are developing in podiatric surgery, often not as quickly as prospective trainees would like, and certainly not as quickly as those of us going through the system and out the other end would like. If people wait around for things to land on their doorstep, they will be waiting a long time - especially in the current NHS.

All the best,
Lee

 

Well, it is tough, it may even be unfair, but then, nobody said that the world would be fair. What you do, is earn your crust in pp and use that to fund your surgical training. It's a sacrifice that all the pioneers made, and it was a damn sight tougher then! Really, the message from all the respondents is that if you want it enough, you will manage.
The tutors might even regard this as a necessary precursor to application for the post.

All the best to your colleague.

Bill Liggins