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Not funding Podiatry Students

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by fayp, Jan 7, 2016.

  1. fayp

    fayp Member


    Members do not see these Ads. Sign Up.
    I have recently emailed the Soc of Pod and Chiropodists, as usual, with no reply from them.
    They have informed members that we must campaign to keep funding for Podiatry Students.
    I completely disagree with them, and they should surely ballot members before they make a decision like this.

    I have had two Podiatry students sit in with me before college to get experience and see if they like the job. They have then gone to college, fully funded by the NHS, both their degree paid for, and money to live on, unlike the majority of students these days. They have left college, not found NHS jobs and set up in direct opposition to me. One even had the cheek to write and ask if she could use my autoclave!

    Why should the NHS continue to fund people when they have no jobs for them. Physiotherapy is in the same boat. Dentists and Doctors pay their own fees and don't get NHS funding to live on. Teachers and many public sector workers fund their own degrees.

    I think funding could be linked to NHS employment, and some fees paid back for each year you commit to NHS employment. Or train a lot less Podiatrists and Physios and use the money to employ them.

    But how can it be fair for the NHS to fund people who go straight into Private practise, or as with Physios, never use their training but find other jobs.
     
  2. fishpod

    fishpod Well-Known Member

    I fully agree with you all we would be campaigning for is to keep podiatry lecturers in jobs training students nobody wants. If we look at pharmacy for example 15 years ago they were getting between 25 32 pounds per hour to locum they were short of pharmacists they open 2/3 new schools like keele hey presto now to many pharmacists 17 pounds per hour and alot less chance of getting up the ranks in an nhs post aswell. The average age of a podiatry graduate is 32 years old this is a telling statistic the profession is not attracting bright 18 year olds but old people who i suspect have already done one useless degree, why then go on to do podiatry love interest? NO . no fees thats why , If the average age is 32 there must be some well crusty students on these courses.Would there be less podiatry students if they had to pay we will see if the suggested changes happen.
     
  3. sdrpod

    sdrpod Member

    Somebody sounds quite bitter that they now have competitors. If your that worried about competition then you need to up your game if your being out done be new grads.

    Also where is this shortage of jobs for new podiatry students exactly there is plenty on nhs jobs at the moment. To be exact jobs are being re advertised as nhs trusts are struggling to recruit.
     
  4. fishpod

    fishpod Well-Known Member

    fays post might sound a little bitter i admit but where are all these nhs jobs you speak of i dont think many pods ever get beyond a band 7 even with 40 years service.Existing on a band 6 salary for all eternity does not encourage high quality applications to the profession. Having to
    many competitors is a bad thing it suits employers not workers. ps there are 8 jobs on the whole nhs website for pods 1 8a 2 band 7 3 band 6 2 band 5 so 2 jobs for graduates is this the plenty you speak of. Which trusts cannot recruit i bet they are not in the midlands or anywhere north of watford just a guess. why because you cannot live near london on a band 5/6 salary. A gp would be considered poor in central london never mind an ahp
     
  5. sdrpod

    sdrpod Member

    There are seasonal changes in regards to jobs typically this time of year there isnt much out come spring summer when the new lot of grads come through there is an increase in the jobs that come up. I can tell you one of the band 5 posts has had its 2nd readvertisement and deadline extended as there is no applicants.

    If your not happy about nhs pay why dont you get off your backside and do something about it. Do some post grad courses expand your knowledge and expand your skill set. Make some connections and make some money privately with this new knowledge. Just because someone has been a band 6 for 40 years does not mean they are in anyway deserving of a band 7 post if one comes up in there own trust.

    Is it so hard these days for people to take responsibility if they want to change somthing in there life for the better instead of expecting it to be gifted to them.
     
  6. fayp

    fayp Member

    I am not bitter, just asking how it is fair that people get full NHS funding, if they then set up in PP and never work for the NHS? Dentist and Doctors pay for their own degrees even if they then work for the NHS. We don't fund teachers, social workers etc
    I know so many physiotherapists that train then never work as Physios. I think it would be better to link fee paid back with those whol then work for the NHS.
    Oddly SDRpod you end your comment saying people should take responsibility....instead of expecting it gifted to them. That's my point exactly. It's easy to train if everything is funded for you and you don't take responsibility. Why shouldn't podiatry students be treated like most other Students?


    Anyhow this is the official reply from the Society



    Hi Fay

    I have spoken with colleagues and the following paragraph is an explanation why we felt as an organisation why we needed to ask members to lobby the Government on this issue:

    Colleagues from across both the Society and the College of Podiatry are seeking to influence Government agencies to ensure that patients continue to benefit from the work of podiatrists through the discipline of podiatry. We are exploring all avenues to safeguard the profession and those who depend upon it for their health. In order to ensure the continuation of our profession the Society as the main membership organisation for podiatry in the UK has an obligation to all our members to do all we can to ensure that there is a greater flow of podiatrists being trained than are retiring in order to maintain the future of the profession.

    In regard to why the membership weren’t consulted, our membership elect a Council to take action on their behalf. In an emergency situation like this one there would not have been time to consult members.

    I hope this answers you questions.

    Best regards

    Adam

    Adam Thomas BA (Hons), Dip DM, MIDM.
    Director of Marketing

    The Society of Chiropodists and Podiatrists
    Second Floor, Quartz House, 207 Providence Square, Mill Street, London, SE1 2EW
     
  7. blinda

    blinda MVP

    ***WARNING - Blatant hijack ahead****

    Shame the Society, or any other professional body for that matter, did not deem it necessary to take similar action in `safeguarding the profession` ie, lobby MP`s when we had the opportunity to urge Parliament to follow the Law Commissions recommendations for a "full review of protected titles and functions".

    I wonder why.

    Sorry for the interruption. Do continue.
     
  8. Kate O

    Kate O Welcome New Poster

    There isn't time for a ballot, the debate is today.

    As someone who is applying this year at the grand age of 33, why are older students a problem? Surely they bring maturity and life experience to the profession, normally qualities quite valued in healthcare professions. Plus they are studying because they have a passion for the job, rather than because uni looks fun. Not all of us had the opportunity to do a degree when younger. Yes you may not have many 'bright 18 year olds' coming in, but I certainly never heard about podiatry as an option from my careers adviser while at school, it seems to be a job people only find out exists when they are older.

    I am now in the position where if I don't manage to secure a place this year, I will have to apply again next year with the likelihood of coming out of university with roughly 30-50k of debt that I will probably never fully pay off. This with only about 6weeks notice to get an application into university to avoid it. I am already going to be struggling by taking 3years out of employment, with two children and a mortgage to support, without the worry of a massive amount of debt on top of that.

    I understand the problem where the NHS is paying for training and people then set up in private practice, but this has been done at far too short notice.
    The answer is probably to charge people tutition and for people to get a chunk of loan written off for every year's service to the NHS they do, but it needs to have a larger changeover period to actually establish what is going to happen instead. So far they have said funding is being cut from Aug 2017 but the other details are getting left til later to sort out.
     
  9. fishpod

    fishpod Well-Known Member

    thanks for the advice sdrpod. Got off my arse25,years ago and got band 9 pay from NHS and a shed load of private practice did not need any courses only a good nose for business and do a good job for each patient whether NHS or private.
    Still think most nhs pay is poor and career progression is limited in the pod profession many of my colleagues have had their grades reduced I have great sympathy for them you are quite right everybody does not merit climbing the ladder but many staff are excellent but opportunities are limited . I have been lucky many people who I graduated with have not had it so easy I even left the profession twice to do unrelated work to get some more of that cash you mention in your post.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2016
  10. Kate O

    Kate O Welcome New Poster

    From previous posts, I imagine these points will be dismissed, but the following points were made about podiatry during the debate about NHS bursary cuts

    "I have a few specific questions for the Minister that come from the petition. How will specialist courses remain viable under the change? Podiatry, for example, tends to be undersubscribed—places on podiatry courses have to go through clearing year in, year out—so it is important that we consider how we can have viable courses for the services that we need." (Paul Scully)

    "Podiatrists provide care to an increasing number of diabetics. People are probably not aware that the life expectancy of someone with a severe diabetic ulcer is poor, ranking above only lung cancer and pancreatic cancer. That is a real threat to patients, so we need podiatrists who can check feet and treat ulcers at an early point. There are only 3,000 podiatrists for the whole of England, yet student numbers have been reduced from 361 to 326. (Dr Philippa Whitford" (Central Ayrshire) (SNP)

    Also this general point, possibly not as applicable to podiatry as nursing but..

    "Let us look at other professions. I certainly do not want people sitting in the Public Gallery to suddenly rush out and change profession completely, but a trainee police officer has a starting salary of ?19,000 and a trainee firefighter starts on ?21,000. Airlines are now moving to in-house training. A new pilot with no flight experience training with British Airways is on ?23,000 and Virgin has a similar policy, with Richard Branson saying that he welcomes those with no experience to be part of the Virgin family from day one. Yet for student nurses, who take similar life and death decisions every single day, we propose not just that they work in clinical areas for free but that they pay for their training as well." (Maria Caulfield (Lewes) (Con)
     
  11. blumley

    blumley Active Member

    not sure where this myth about there being no NHS jobs comes from. Qualified about 3 years ago and people were saying the same things then, but everyone who was set on working in the nhs got jobs in the nhs. My career seems to be progressing well now working as a band 6 and most others who i speak to are doing well. Agree that the degree tends to attract a lot of mature students, I was one of the youngest at 21 with most people in late 20's early 30's. With regards to the bursary yeah it was a nice bonus but if this is what you truly want to do then it won't put most people off.
     
  12. fishpod

    fishpod Well-Known Member

    Kate O there you are podiatry places go through clearing year after year what does this mean.
    It means nobody wants to do podiatry and going through clearing attracts weak applicants. no dentists or pharmacists go through clearing the unis offer more places than are available and fill every place at every uni . As to starting salaries my best friends kids recently graduated and got on a graduate scheme for 2 employers 0ne is 0n 35 grand one on 27 grand they both did politics and economics. If you cant secure a place this year when many of the places go through clearing you would seem to be the type of applicant i am alluding to.
     
  13. Kate O

    Kate O Welcome New Poster

    I was shocked when I heard that. Every one else seems to tell me that it's a popular course and is it's very competitive to get a place.
    As lovely as a starting salary of 35k sounds, I'd want a lot more than that to have politicians as my work colleagues.
     
  14. fishpod

    fishpod Well-Known Member

    Hi kate they dont work with politicians or in politics they just took a course with the word politics in. And if as seems to be the case that many places are filled via clearing it clearly is not very competitive and if the average age of a graduate is 32 its not very popular either as the courses my friends kids do attract virtually no mature students. Good luck if you apply, podiatry is a bit of a backwater but it is fun and can be rewarding in many ways.
     
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