Rothbarts Devices-the Snake Oil Stops Here?

Like I said before, Alex, it's too bad that the only way we know you is as a supporter of the Rothbart system of proprioceptive insoles. If you talk to most any podiatrist, no matter what treatment they use on their patients, they will say "my patients are getting better". So to make this claim to support what you do means nothing to me and means very little to most of us on this forum.

Maybe you can give us some other explanation how Rothbart's little varus forefoot wedge insoles do all the wonderful things that he and you claim. I have been through his webpage and found it to be an absolute joke. There is no known mechanical explanation for his claims that his insoles cure every seeming type of malady...very reminiscent of the snake oil salesman of yesteryear. Maybe you can explain the mechanics behind these little insoles that you say "works".

By the way, Alex, I love your photo on Rothbart's website. Is this the way you hope to finally get your 5 minutes of fame on the internet??"Alex Catto says: I'll email you later and bore you with some of my cases and thoughts on the product. But basically I've had better results in the last 3 months than the last 10 years!"

 

What is even better is that in this "testimonial e-mail" from Alex to Brian (scroll down beyond photo and letter from Ms Dieter Fellner!):

http://www.rothbartsfoot.info/DPMComments.html
Alex can't spell his own name correctly.

 

In addition to my earlier response, I would also add:

Here:
http://www.back2feet.net/aboutus.html


Vested Interest

Hence this whole thread started by you is nothing but product promotion for financial gain.

Have a nice day. Drink Robeer its great!

 

Did you know RoBeer also cures infertility?

Oh yes indeed. Wheresoever it may be.

LOVED That website Alex! almost as good as Brian's and in a very similar style. Some real solid science there. I particularly liked:-

Unlike Rothbarts model which we all agree on!

http://www.back2feet.net/pickingrightpci.html
I just LOVED this whole page. You heard it here first folks, a single page of instructions for the patient to carry out their OWN biomechanical assessment AT HOME ON THEMSELVES IN TWO MINUTES!!!!!!!

Cool. I could use some more energy!

What causes over-pronation?

I could go on but i'm in danger of herniating from laughing too much. Alex you asked if the snake oil stopped here, Very obviously not

Good laugh though

Regards

RoBeer

By the way i would STILL like to know how you differentiate between a PMS and a forefoot supinatus if all you are doing is measuring between the big toe and the ground!

 

I thought you'd enjoy that one boys

 

Dear Alex

I didn't really want to get into this discussion again but looking at your web site promted me to have my 2 penny worth (apologies in advance)

I would like to think I have an open mind and, maybe the PCI do work better for you. However in about 2001 I read about and tried prescribing Rothbart type proprioceptive insoles. I tried them for myself and precribed them to several customers. Basically they are crap! They didn't work for me or any of my customers barr one. They all came back with a miriad of complaints. The one person that they did work for has come back twice for new ones and is quite pleased with them. If you would like I will try and find their names and addresses on my database and see if they will send a testamonial to say how dissatisfied they were with Rothbart type insoles.
Would you print these on your web site?

I tried Dr Brian Rothbart style medial column technology Postural Control insoles and they are crap D.S. of Folkestone UK.
(if long names make insoles work better these must be great)

Alex perhaps the reason that you get better results in the last 3 months than in the last 10 years maybe because even tho the PCI are crap they are better crap than the rubbish you turned out before.
I don't know any half decent Podiatrist who isn't getting consistently good results with their orthotic prescription. (hands up if you are not)

The psuedo science on your web site is just that. Good marketing I agree and if that is the objective then fair play to you. Nothing wrong with making a profit. But please don't come onto a forum like this until you have the science to back up your claims, it just makes you look foolish.

When you first posted this thread I quite admired you for attempting to address a difficult subject that was bound to get rebuked. After reading your web site I realise your just naive at best or a smart salesman at best.

I feel that you would get more respect, but less sales, if you said I've tried these insoles and they work for me but I dont know why. Can anyone explain? Instead of the rediculous SCIENTIFIC PROOF like a RED line drawn from the foot to the brain proves the foot is connected to the brain and so any thing that is connected to the foot changes the way the brain controls the whole body. What nonsense is that.

You critisize Root theory but offer no reliable theory about PCI.
You say that Podiatry argues about the validity of Root theory like its a bad thing. Hey! that is how we progress, we are not blinkered and dogmatically stuck in the past. Do you really think that the Root theory moderated by a mechanically sound tissue stress aproach that reassesses the action of forces about recently researched dynamic anatomical axes is inferior to PCI medial column technology. If you do you are not just niave but a half wit.
Its like saying Newtons laws are not proven and levers don't work.

There is so much rubbish on your and Rothbarts web site it beggars belief.

The 3D Formetric scanner ,

I don't believe that one camera can give any 3D characterisation let alone to accurately characterise the spinal joint 3D positions to about +/-1mm. This precision is not possible even with the latest 3D eight camera Vicon systems.

It may well be true that these insoles work for some people and we/I may yet have to eat our words when you come up with conclusive evidence or even some reasonably good science. But like other 'New Products' it won't be the anwer to 99% of all problems however much you would like it to be.

I believe you may with psuedo science be distracting and misleading young or naive minds to believe your unproven rubbish. I find this distasteful.


All the best Dave Smith

 

It's usually at this point that brian jets off to nassau!

 

I Believe I have been both distracted and mislead. Can I claim compensation?

Naive but happy of Plymouth.

P.S. Here's an interesting quote: "95% of statistics are made up on the spot"- Vic Reeves

P.P.S. I'm now sponsored by an alcoholic drink manufacture. Shame on you Robeer for suggesting that it was alcohol free- I Believe you may be distracting and misleading young or naive minds to Believe your unproven rubbish. I find this distasteful. Moreover, what's the point? As a consequence I am being exploited by the company and I have to add an ad to all of my postings, here goes with the first of several until I get bored with this gag:

I was pissing myself left, right and centre until I drank Robeer. Now my incontinence is cured

You know you'll get bored of this before me Believe

 

It makes interesting reading to look back at Alex first post in this thread again.

 

Dave,

I hear from another thread that you will be buying beers
http://www.podiatry-arena.com/podiatry-forum/showpost.php?p=18904&postcount=9

Would that be Robeer by any chance? because:

The missus and I had been trying for a baby for ages, then one night we both drank ten pints of Robeer and now she's up the duff. Robeer- curing infertility without the need for IVF. Believe

Told you.

P.S. I think (hope) this thread has probably run it's course. There is a 95% chance that the snake oil guys have realised that while you can blag some of the people (62.4%) some of the time, Sometimes (57.54% of the time) it's better to take the money and run. The reallity is though: they'll be the ones laughing all the way to the bank and sleeping like babies tonight, safe in the knowledge that there is a sucker born every minute. Believe

 

Probably true. However this thread has provided me with more laughs in the last dozen or so posts than i've had in ages. I think it has also firmly placed our colleague in the "blatantly self serving snake oil salesman abusing a scientific discussion forum for some free advertising" catagory. I was almost interested in what he had to say before i saw that website. If there is truly no such thing as bad publicity then he's done ok but i don't think he'll be taken seriously by anyone who has read this thread. In which case our job is truly done and we have minimized the damage!


NEXT

Regards
RoBeer

PS

Thanks for this but i'd need at least two more random, unproven, unscientific statisically insignificant cases before i'll go global claiming to have found the elixir of fertility. I beLIEve 3 anecdotal cases is the new benchmark for statistical certainty. Anyone else? Personally the only thing i'd be able to acheive if my missus had had ten pints would be to hold her hair out of the toilet!

PPS
Quit with the beLIEve. You're starting to sound like fox mulder!

PPPS

Somebody needs to use their own product. If the waste passed out of the colon more efficiently they might not be so full of S**t!