I was just wondering if anyone had encountered people obtaining Plantar Fasciosis which may have been influenced by wearing Nike Free's? I was just wondering if it could be linked at all as several people I have come across have gotten it and notably after having started to wear the frees for a few months despite following the wearing in process.
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Tissue parameters of Achilles tendon and plantar fascia in healthy subjects using a handheld myotono
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Effect of Arch Height and Material Hardness of Foot Orthotics
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Hi there Laura,
I was given a pair of Nike Free shoes last year whilst I attended the Nike Research Labs in Portland ,Oregon, USA. I attended a seminar with Maro Lafortune, the chief biomechanist with Nike. Plantar Fasiosis was mentioned as a complication by some other medical practitioners during the seminar. Nike claimed that because the shoe allows the foot to function naturally, some stretches etc may be required to allow soft tissue adaptions. I have been wearing them for a while now and I must admit I found them quite strange and caused discomfort over my met heads, 2nd and 3rd, to be exact.
I never experienced any heel pain.
I have copies of the lectures from Nike on their research on the Fee range and would be happy to send them to you if you send me an email. I don't know if Nike would allow me to publish them on the mail base.
Cheers
Sean -
I think you may find that its more of an irritation at the origin of the intrinsics - FDB/FHB and quadratus plantar. I think thats the idea with the free's that its designed to increase activity and strength through these muscles, and if they are used a lot or with the wrong type of activity, these intrinsics get quite aggravated. Settle it down with standard heel pain management and then begin calf stretch/strength program.
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hi footsoldier,
I have been suggesting patients to use it as a rehab type shoe in the sub-acute stages of a range of foot pathologies. I have some evidence but only a real basic presentation put out by NIKE. Could I get you to email the info through to me at gareth@lifecarefrankston.com
I am happy to swap any info I might have that may interest you.
Cheers,
Gareth -
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Thank you for your thoughts, from the few athletes I have spoken with that have experienced complications, they were newly formed complaints. Whilst they felt their feet to have grown stronger, they believe it to have thrown out their normal gait patterns even though they wear them for a short time
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The problem with the Frees is that they do not have the main advantage of barefeet which is a reduced STj moment arm. However they do have one of the main disadvantages which is reduced surface area for GRF (which = increased pressure for weight bearing area). You are basically on a instable, soft elevated sole. It is not surprising that this would increase the tissue stress on the plantar area of the feet.
There may still be advantages to wearing the frees in that they make the foot work a bit more. I think the same advantages could be made from barefoot walking and running. Will this help the intrinsic muscle strength and control or cause dysfunctions? A similar argument is made for MBT's.
I like to wear the Frees about once a week. They are mostly comfortable for wearing similar to a slipper. Besides they look good! -
If a person was to run all the time with them on regular flat surfaces such as concrete, and they have unstable foot posture, then they could conceivably cause injury.
It is akin to telling a person with poor posture to strengthen their back by lying in a bean bag... -
I do know one person who runs all their training in them successfully. I think that she is an exception just as the people who do all of their training barefoot are.
The message of it being a component of training does not always get through to retail. -
Nike Free are "fake shoes" talking barefoot whilst being nothing like barefoot. The Pegasus is arguably more barefoot than a Nike Free. Free's are super wobbly, how can this be anything like barefoot? Many people wearing Nike Free's are over pronating down the street. The point of barefoot is stability and elastic recoil, not just flexibility. Yes, flexibility is important but flexibility is irrelevant without stability and elastic recoil. Wobbly cushioning kills stability. Arch support kills elastic recoil. I fear Podiatrists are drowning in information researching a faulty paradigm whilst starved of wisdom based on human experience and facts. 80% (99%?) of foot problems are simple to fix...by addressing inappropriate loading and inappropriate footwear. Indeed I've got 99 problems but my foot ain't 1... What is a healthy foot from a podiatrist's point of view? Anatomy Function and Biomechanics
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Do you include Nike Free in Minimalist running shoes? They are fake barefoot but people think they are buying barefoot so they should be included as people bought into the philosophy. What % is Nike Free of Nike's sales? And of total sales. Do you have latest sales info here somewhere?
Thank you Craig, I am here to learn and discuss not be a barefoot idiot. PS. Humans need shoes. I am a proponent of health strong elastic flexible feet - there is nothing controversial about healthy feet. It makes sense wearing thin flat wide shoes, loading appropriately and moving skilfully all help to achieve healthy strong elastic flexible feet. I have worked with thousands of feet, for sure some are beyond repair but it is less than 1% in the thousands I have seen...NB by barefoot shoes I mean zero cushioning, wide, flat - simple. Minimalist shoes are a different philosophy, I am not being an evangelist, I am defining terms. Thank you again. -
Please tell me how Nike Free shoes are "fake shoes"? What is your definition of a shoe?
And for that matter, you seem very concerned about how "barefoot" one shoe is versus another shoe. Do you realize that as soon as you put on a shoe you are not barefoot? In that regard, in your opinion, what makes one shoe more "barefoot" than another shoe?
Please provide a scientific research reference for your statement "the point of barefoot is stability and elastic recoil, and not just flexibility". And by the way, anything that Chris McDougall wrote can't be considered as a scientific reference since he is not a scientist, just a sports writer.
Also, please provide scientific research references for your statements:
1. "Yes, flexibility is important but flexibility is irrelevant without stability and elastic recoil.
2. "Wobbly cushioning kills stability."
3. "Arch support kills elastic recoil."
And finally, what do you base your statement "I fear Podiatrists are drowning in information researching a faulty paradigm whilst starved of wisdom based on human experience and facts." I have no clue about what you are talking about.
Please explain yourself, and remember, the barefoot and minimalist running fad died a few years ago.... -
Runners have lost interest. It was a fad that failed them. Their experiences with it and the subsequent scientific evidence did not live up to the hype, propaganda, rhetoric and word salads about it.
As for your contention that they "work", that is contradicted by the actual published scientific evidence. Injury rates between barefoot/minimalist vs traditional shod are the same. 6 of one half dozen of the other. I prefer to stick to the evidence.
This 'debate' ended a few yrs ago. -
Eric -
Apologies Eric, I do not wish to insult the profession, this is not helpful or respectful.
It is my belief Orthotics should be a very very rare intervention and used when improving movement skill ie posture and weight distribution, strength, flexibility, elasticity and footwear have failed or there are severe contraindications to even consider training.
I can understand the concept of Orthotics for short term pain relief however, rest and movement also work. Training and appropriate footwear could the first steps in helping most foot problems. There are simple solutions. Cushioning and support decondition and deform feet. Many (99%) foot problems could be avoided in the first place. An ounce of prevention etc..
Certain interventions such as Morton's pads for Morton's foot short 1st met head and to relieve mid dorsal foot pain make sense. But not arch support for PF. Or Morton's Neuroma pads.
As regards the long term use of Orthotics, we have heard the analogies a million times. When we have a bad back is it missing painkillers and a brace? Or is the pain a sign we need to improve our ability to handle gravity - ie our movement skill = posture, strength and flexibility?
There must be many areas we agree on to improve feet and I'd love to explore them. A healthy foot is relatively wide, strong, flexible and elastic. It may have a higher arch or a lower arch, the arch will be functional. Ankles will be aligned. The big toe will be strong and take appropriate load.
If there is a Morton's foot structure, a pad is required to load the 1st Met head appropriately. If the ankle is over pronated, a strengthening and movement skill improvement program will help in most cases.
Movement skill is at the top of the hierarchy, form follows function, not the other way round. -
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Should we rarely use foot orthotics in stage 2 posterior tibial tendon dysfunction? (and risk litigation if you did not)
etc
And as Ian asked above, citation please
Please explain how a "movement skill improvement program " will correct the overpronation associated with, for eg a forefoot varus, or a, for eg medially located STJ axis etc etc
You do realise that there are probably a 100 different causes of "overpronation". What you are advocating will be an epic fail and dangerous advice for a lot of them - it is simply impossible for movement retraining to work in those foot types.
For some of them what you are advocating can work in the longer term, and a lot of us do use that approach in those it probably could work in.
The scientific evidence is clear: foot orthotics work and they do not weaken muscles.
There is NO evidence supporting what you are advocating.
If you want to advocate alternative approaches, then you need to stop making things up; contradicting the actual scientific evidence; or basing it on a poor understanding of the topic (and BTW, I "wrote the book" on alternative theories and approaches - been there done that with so many people so many times over the years)
I will be the first to change my mind when the evidence tells me.Last edited by a moderator: Jun 19, 2017-
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Tissue parameters of Achilles tendon and plantar fascia in healthy subjects using a handheld myotono
|
Effect of Arch Height and Material Hardness of Foot Orthotics
>
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