Band 5 vs Band 6

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Hi all,

I wonder if you can help me at all?

When our department went through Agenda for Change Senior II Podiatrists became Band 6 Podiatrists.

We understood a Band 5 to be a purely Preceptorship post for newly qualified Podiatrists or those who'd been out of work for several years. At the end of the preceptorship you'd be promoted to Band 6. As a Band 5 you weren't able to carry out new patient assessments or design treatment plans or do nail surgery/MSK/ulcer clinics. I was also under the impression that a Band 5 is a supervivised role.

Now we're under pressure from Commissioners to have "more Band 5 posts", rather than Band 6's. We've also been informed that at the end of the preceptorship they would remain a Band 5. I've been unable to get specific information from Commissioners or my line manager (we have no Head of Podiatry any more) about what distinguishes a Band 5 from a Band 6 role.

Can anyone tell me - or point me in the direction of a specific document (I've done an internet trawl and the only thing I found of use was from Bolton PCT about the Implementation or Preceptorship) - what does a Band 6 Podiatrist do that is beyond the job profile of a Band 5?

thank you!

 

Depends.

In the original AFC document a band 5 post scored 5 on the "knowledge skills and experience" catagory. This was somebody within a year of qualification and yes, there was to be supervision.

I understand this has now changed.

Basically the document you need to look at is the job description. This will have been matched to a banding by a matching panel.

Otherwise, go to the AFC handbook and look up the KSE section.

But either way, remember a job is what you are asked to do, not what you are.

 

Hi,

Although i have no information on a document that can help you, this is a problem that is common place in the NHS.

In my opinion there is nothing a band 5 podiatrist with more than 12 months nhs experience and mentoring cant do in comparison to a band 6.

The difference between a band 5 and band 6 podiatrsit after the initial 12 months of completing a proceptorship and mentoring programme is money (or the major lack of).

I'm currently a band 5 podiatrist with my own biomechanics clinic, undertaking new patient assessments and nail surgery on a rota up to and including all aspects of a band 6 post. Ive been working for just under 18 months.

As there is currently no money in the NHS to pay for band 6 podiatrists, once a band 5 reaches this competancy there is blurring of the lines separating the band 5 to a band 6.

The trust i work for are in the same situation, they are hiring band 5s to replace 6s that have left the trust.

It seems completely unfair to me that i get paid less than other members of staff for doing the same job.
In some cases I cover a band 7 and 8 biomechanics clinics when required where as 90% of the band 6s either refuse or haven't got the confidence to undertake the clinic.

Where is the line drawn??? to me there doesnt seem to be one at all.:bash:

Sorry Rant over :wacko::wacko::wacko::wacko:

 

Robert,
Thank you for your reply: there is no job description for a Band 5 Podiatrist within our trust: one was never written as all Band II's were given a band 6.
"Go to the AFC hand book and look up KSE framework"... not terribly helpful if you don't know what the "AFC handbook" is (I'm aware of the Knowledge, Skills Framework).
Clarification please?
Also "a job is what you are asked to do, not what you are" - fair point, but it's also what you're paid to do and I think it's fair to assume that most people want to be paid fairly for what they do for a living.

Little pink pod - you've just confirmed my worst fears. That we'll be pushed into effectively downgrading our staff and our jobs and ultimately our profession. Except for MSK podiatrists who somehow attract a lot more kudos.

 

Oh dear - last post was bitter and grumpy: Sorry!
It's been a long and rather horrible week. Roll on the weekend and a fresh start on Monday morning!

 

Also, Little-pink-pod : might it be worth you going to Human Resources and asking to have the job that you currently do re-graded? If you can prove you're working to a Band 6 spec then you might be in with a chance.

 

One last thing before hometime: Doh! AFC is Agenda for Change, isn't it?
thank you. :0)

 

really??? ill have to ask then, although im pretty sure the response in the current climate will be that im lucky to have a job lol

 

Hi Charlie70,

In my time travelling the country in 2008/9 for a well establishedorthoticd supplier I came across the north east special interest group for biotech. Thus group produced competency guidelines relating to the positions of band 5 & 6 pods working in mal and directly linked these measures against the KSF.

I have a copy at work if you would like to email me privately...Neville.parker@pat.nhs.uk

Alternatively you could contact he group diret

regards


Neville

 

Well Sh!t Charlie, sorry I wasn't more help. Google broken in yorkshire?

The AFC handbook is one of the Core NHS documents. Google it and its hits 1 through 5. *

However It would appear that the JE stuff is no longer in the AFC handbook so technically I gave you bad advice anyway. So for you reading pleasure, the document you want is the Job evaluation handbook. It bears a superficial relationship to the satan spawned KSF, but only superficial.

Its here

http://www.nhsemployers.org/Aboutus...NHS_Job_Evaluation_Handbook_third_edition.pdf

and you want pages 23 through 31. Don't thank me all at once, I get embarrassed.

Here is the bit you may want

I'm sure they do. But that is not how the world works. You get paid for what you're asked / told to do, not what you actually do. If Gordon Ramsey went for a job at KFC he'd be paid at KFC rates. If he did not want to work at KFC then he should not apply for the job.

Sadly, the NHS will increasingly be wanting a Mcpodiatry dept, which is bloody tough for the people who can do more than mcnuggets.

Regards
Robert

* You're not the only one at the end of a long week.

 

Robert,
Thank you!! (and yes, duly chastened).

 

Any time

 

He's a cruel man - cruel, but fair.

This was after he nailed your wife's head to a coffee table?