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Message to all those who we have banned

Discussion in 'Podiatry Arena Help, Suggestions and Comments' started by admin, Apr 18, 2014.

  1. admin

    admin Administrator Staff Member

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  2. Bad day, Craig??:butcher::rolleyes:
  3. admin

    admin Administrator Staff Member

    I just tired of people quoting the 1st Amendment to me when I ban or censure someone from the US. I not even American and know enough about the US constitution to know that the principle of freedom of speech apply to protection from the govt; not to private business (let alone one that is not even based in the USA!)
  4. Just tell them that they have the right to free speech, but only on their own website!:drinks
  5. admin

    admin Administrator Staff Member

    I do....but it still surprises me how many in the USA get cranky when I point out how little they know about their own constitution!
  6. David Smith

    David Smith Well-Known Member

    Craig, you should just say you that you've issued an Executive Order. Any American will understand that, their President(Presidents) do it all the time and they love it :rolleyes::eek:
    Executive Orders trump Constitutional and Human rights every time!!!
  7. W J Liggins

    W J Liggins Well-Known Member

    No time for niceties with these people Craig. Just use the chant of the Agincourt archers. 'F off!'


  8. wdd

    wdd Well-Known Member


    Is the ban for life or do they get a second chance after a certain period of 'punishment'?

    Not that punishment usually prevents reoffending as far as prisoners are concerned - apart from the notable exception of capital punishment. But that might be a step too far - then again?

  9. If I was Craig, I wouldn't give them a second chance...they will just do it again. They can always read the comments here even though they are banned from the site. If they want to start their own website, then they are free to do so.
  10. Lab Guy

    Lab Guy Well-Known Member

    I wish that those that continue to use this forum as a means to promote their products (despite advertising on this site) would be banned. I can think of one person in particular and I am disappointed that person has not been banned on this academic site.

    It is one thing to start your own thread to discuss your product, but it is another thing entirely to always bring up your product in threads started by others. Ban the parasites that only post with the agenda and intention to sell their goods rather than the intent to bring forth knowledge and understanding for the common good.

  11. Good idea. How about it Craig? Give the people selling their product two warning notices then ban them on the third time for plugging their product?
  12. wdd

    wdd Well-Known Member

    I have two suggestions that might eliminate the need for banning anyone from the sight.

    The first is to censor the posts of those who would otherwise be banned. The unacceptable section/s could simply be cut out. Some indication, eg a stamp saying Censored would be applied to the post. Who knows the censored remains of the original posts might acquire a new dimension and what was valuless might gain a value added component?

    My second idea, which could either be activated on its own or in conjunction with my first idea would be the creation of a podiatry area Room 101?

  13. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Active Member

    Aloha Craig,

    We thank you for hard and persistant work on our community website that you are the leader/owner of.

    The position you are in is a difficult one, and i will admitt i have not made it much eiser,, with all my spelling errors and such.

    There are fine lines that between science and commerce and we may not want to limit the flow between the two. Often science and commerce sit equally on our heads. How else do we pay the bills and feed our family's?

    Personally i think everyone deserves multiple chances as long as they are not threating or abusive or wanting to monopolize the discussions. If someone wants to sell their biomechanics book on this biomechanics website more better. Perhaps they can also help fund this site buy advertising on it.

    I understand my fellow Americans hold their rights tight to their hearts but this has been born of nessessity and past good deeds.

    FDR on Free Speech

    A Hui Hou,
  14. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Active Member


    Here is a little background on the legality of US commercial free speech. It is protected by not overly so. Perhaps Craig has every right to allow whomever he wants on this his commercial website?

    From Wikipedia,

    Commercial speech is speech done on behalf of a company or individual for the purpose of making a profit. Unlike political speech, the Supreme Court does not afford commercial speech full protection under the First Amendment. To effectively distinguish commercial speech from other types of speech for purposes of litigation, the Court uses a list of four indicia:[116]

    1.The contents do "no more than propose a commercial transaction."
    2.The contents may be characterized as advertisements.
    3.The contents reference a specific product.
    4.The disseminator is economically motivated to distribute the speech.
    Alone, each indicium does not compel the conclusion that an instance of speech is commercial; however, "[t]he combination of all these characteristics...provides strong support for...the conclusion that the [speech is] properly characterized as commercial speech."[117]

    In Valentine v. Chrestensen (1942),[118] the Court upheld a New York City ordinance forbidding the "distribution in the streets of commercial and business advertising matter."[119] Writing for a unanimous court, Justice Owen Roberts explained:

    This court has unequivocally held that streets are proper places for the exercise of the freedom of communicating information and disseminating opinion and that, though the states and municipalities may appropriately regulate the privilege in the public interest, they may not unduly burden or proscribe its employment in their public thoroughfares. We are equally clear that the Constitution imposes no such restraint on government as respects purely commercial advertising.[120]

    In Virginia State Pharmacy Board v. Virginia Citizens Consumer Council (1976),[121] the Court overruled Valentine and ruled that commercial speech was entitled to First Amendment protection:

    What is at issue is whether a State may completely suppress the dissemination of concededly truthful information about entirely lawful activity, fearful of that information's effect upon its disseminators and its recipients... [W]e conclude that the answer to this one is in the negative.[122]

    In Ohralik v. Ohio State Bar Association (1978),[123] the Court ruled that commercial speech was not protected by the First Amendment as much as other types of speech:

    We have not discarded the "common-sense" distinction between speech proposing a commercial transaction, which occurs in an area traditionally subject to government regulation, and other varieties of speech. To require a parity of constitutional protection for commercial and noncommercial speech alike could invite a dilution, simply by a leveling process, of the force of the [First] Amendment's guarantee with respect to the latter kind of speech.[124]

    In Central Hudson Gas & Electric Corp. v. Public Service Commission (1980),[125] the Court clarified what analysis was required before the government could justify regulating commercial speech:

    1.Is the expression protected by the First Amendment? Lawful? Misleading? Fraud?
    2.Is the asserted government interest substantial?
    3.Does the regulation directly advance the governmental interest asserted?
    4.Is the regulation more extensive than is necessary to serve that interest?
    Six years later, the U.S. Supreme Court, applying the Central Hudson standards in Posadas de Puerto Rico Associates v. Tourism Company of Puerto Rico (1986),[126] affirmed the Supreme Court of Puerto Rico's conclusion that Puerto Rico's Games of Chance Act of 1948, including the regulations thereunder, was not facially unconstitutional. The lax interpretation of Central Hudson adopted by Posadas was soon restricted under 44 Liquormart, Inc. v. Rhode Island (1996),[127] when the Court invalidated a Rhode Island law prohibiting the publication of liquor prices.

    A Hui Hou,
    An Outspoken American
  15. wdd

    wdd Well-Known Member

    The association of science and commerce is a fine line and one that needs to be continually monitored, clarified, patrolled, reinforced, cleared and re-established. This represents one of Craig's many tasks. One in which he is ably assissted by many on this site.

    Scientific outcomes are always, to a greater or lesser extent, distorted/biased by commerce. The greater the commercial influence the greater the bias in the science.

    In extreme cases, on this site, where commercial interest has overwhelmed the science and the bias is recognisable to all but the perpetrator, the scientific community must act to maintain its borders and the most effective way is to cut out the cancer.

    If cutting out the cancer is analogous to a ban then a permanent ban would seem appropriate and is the easiest and most effective solution when one or a small number of otherwise busy people is patrolling the border.

    Because the posts of of those promoting commercially terminally infected science often contain interesting and sometimes pertinent points quarantine might represent a useful alternative to a ban although it would be necessary to ensure that the method of quarantine removed the risk of contamination and that could represent an overwhelming load for the infection control officer.

    The easiest answer would undoubtedly be to "cut off their goolies".


  16. blinda

    blinda MVP

  17. Peter

    Peter Well-Known Member

    I think the room 101 is a good idea......but can we call it 'the **** bin'?
  18. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Active Member

    Aloha Bill,

    I assume you assume that "the bias is recognisable to all but the perpetrator" but perhaps they could also be considered "penetrators"of new technology and science.


    Dr. Steven King

    Voting Member on
    American Society of Testing Materials (ASTM)

    F13 Footwear Safety and Traction
    E 54 Homeland Security Applications and Body Armor
  19. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Active Member

    Aloha Bill,

    Please i beg to differ with your comment.

    "Scientific outcomes are always, to a greater or lesser extent, distorted/biased by commerce"

    Perhaps you think that most companies are run and owned by their marketing departments and not the engineering departments,, which unfortunately is mostly true.

    Many Many businesses of commerce are dependant on solid scientific research to expand the quality and effectiveness of their products. They may not report all the results to their competition.

    How else would race car teams develop faster cars and pit crews?

  20. Lab Guy

    Lab Guy Well-Known Member


    Perhaps instead of banning the parasites that only use this forum to sell their overpriced patented goods, you should instead charge them an advertising fee. On every post that they mention their products to serve their own agenda, they get charged an advertising fee. For example, if you charged $50 per post that mentions their product and they do this 3 times in one month, their bill would be $150.00 for advertising on threads. If they fail to pay their bill, they are banned. At the very bottom of About on the right hand corner, you can have number of paid ads.

    Join Date: Feb 2010
    Posts: 355
    Join Date: Feb 2010
    Marketplace reputation 0% (0)
    CPD Points: 9,880 [What is this?]
    Thanks: 224
    Thanked 100 Times in 70 Post
    Paid poster ads: 0

    Now, the posters are no longer parasites but posters helping to fund your website and we now know there is no hidden agenda from the poster.

    Your very valuable posters who have contributed endless posts and received a zillion thanks have greatly increased the intrinsic value of your website by increasing traffic. These people have devoted countless hours to help their colleagues on a myriad of topics rather than just one. They should be justly rewarded with free monthly advertising should they have a service or product for us to be aware of.

    Parasites can have their freedom of speech, but on Podiatry-Arena, let them pay for it. I doubt we will see any more self-promotion on PA.

  21. wdd

    wdd Well-Known Member

    I assume you assume that "the bias is recognisable to all but the perpetrator" but perhaps they could also be considered "penetrators"of new technology and science.


    I was assuming the integrity of the 'perpetrators', ie that they were promoting their obviously biased quasi science because they were too close to it and so dependent upon its success that they were unable to see that it was biased. Otherwise I would have to assume that they were knowingly putting commercial interest ahead of the science and were knowingly using bad science to promote their commercial interest.

    I don't understand the phrase '"penetrator" of new science and technology'? Is it a new form of sexual perversion or does it indicate someone who is prepared to stuff the science and technology as long as they can make money out of it?

  22. wdd

    wdd Well-Known Member

    "Scientific outcomes are always, to a greater or lesser extent, distorted/biased by commerce"

    Hi Steve,

    No problem, in theory at least, extending 'lesser' to include zero on rare, possibly very rare occasions.


    Of co
  23. wdd

    wdd Well-Known Member

    "Scientific outcomes are always, to a greater or lesser extent, distorted/biased by commerce"

    Hi Steve,

    No problem, in theory at least, extending 'lesser' to include zero on rare, possibly very rare occasions.

  24. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Active Member

    Aloha Bill,

    One of the issues we have on this web site is anonymity.

    When i research who you are on this site it is not apparent.

    I do not know if you are a paid professional blogger paid to maintain the status quo for existing shoe companies or if you are a highly respected podiatric researcher and practicioner.

    Since you are concerned about "obviously biased quasi science" would you please ask the perpertrators directly for publicly published research results? Or ask them to leave this site and be ready to give scientific reasons why thier science is inferior to yours.

    I humbly do appologize but it takes alot to get through thick skulls.
    "I don't understand the phrase '"penetrator""

    It is tough teaching the teachers... they often are so biased to knowing it all...

    A Hui Hou,
  25. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Active Member


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  26. Steven:

    This one is especially for you:

  27. Dr. Steven King

    Dr. Steven King Active Member

    Aloha Kevin,

    Are you teaching me to "Do what i say not what i do...?"

    "It has been a long time coming, but I finally have my hands on a book that Eric Fuller and I wrote a chapter for on Subtalar Joint Axis Location and Tissue Stress Approach to Biomechanical Therapy of the Foot and Lower Extremity. The title of the book: Lower Extremity Biomechanics: Theory and Practice, Volume 1, edited by Stephen F. Albert and Sarah A. Curran. It is published by Bipedmed, LLC, Denver, Colorado, 2013. The book may be ordered at: http://www.bipedmed.com/"

    These are my personal forum favorites,
    Be Welcoming!

    When newcomers arrive, welcome them to our growing worldwide community of Podiatrists. Many of our community's senior members are a wealth of knowledge and have much to share. Help new members learn about how to find information and resources, save time, and how to get involved in the Community.

    Be Courteous!

    Don't attack others. Personal attacks on others will not be tolerated. Challenge others' points of view and opinions, but do so respectfully and thoughtfully ... without insult and personal attack.

    We have developed new composite based mechanical orthotic systems and we have asked the learned folks here on Podiatry Arena to review our Government (and your tax dollars) funded research results.

    What is so wrong with building footwear with over 6000 newtons of puncture resistance when the current PU based combat boots only have 665 and EVA foam based shoes have 60 newtons of resistance. IS THAT NOT WORTHY TO COMMUNICATE ??

    "Podiatry Arena is a forum for communication between foot health professionals and the rules and guidelines for the conduct in the forum reflect that."


    Prior Army Officer and Podiatrist

    Co-Principal Investigator SBIR A11-109 "Advanced Composite Insoles for the Reduction of Stress Fractures." funded by the United States Department of Defense and Army Medical Research and Materials Command and Kevin Kirby...
  28. Steven:

    It is worthy to communicate....once is sufficient....not in every posting you make here.

    So, Steve, I'll say it again:

    Please make sure that you are posting for the good of the community, not just for the sake of self-promotion.

    All of you who want Steve to never,ever mention anything again about his "Advanced Composite Insoles" here on Podiatry Arena please post the following short note to Steven King in this thread:

    Please stop spamming Podiatry Arena, Steven King!
  29. wdd

    wdd Well-Known Member

    Aye it's a sair fecht.

  30. blinda

    blinda MVP


    I have no desire to enter into dialogue with anyone on my ignore list, which includes Mr King and wholeheartedly agree with your above post.

    That said, if he were to cease promoting his products in every post, then maybe, just maybe the community could engage in useful communication and I would be delighted to remove him from `the List`.

    Eternal Optimist, me.


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