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Unsupervised Scalpel Weilding Pod A's

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by DTT, Nov 23, 2009.

  1. DTT

    DTT Well-Known Member

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    Hi All

    Ive taken a quote from Bob Golding R>E>G from the socap thread as I think it raises an issue worth debate

    Firstly this is NOT a point scoring thing on my part I hold no aligence to any pro body save my indemnity insurance so testosterone and hormones in place please.

    I have known Bob to be a staunch supporter of the SCP for many years and know his strong views re FHP's so it comes as no surprise to me that he hs done the honorable thing and resigned over this.
    It would appear to me as an outsider that the implementation of this if it is to be implemented throughout the NHS would have a wider impact on the profession.

    Now the Podiatry Assistants have the same skills as an FHP who are taught scalpel techniques and are insured to use them, are the NHS about to downgrade the podiatry entry to NVQ level in the main and that leaves the degree trained post graduate pods where exactly ?? They will have nowhere to train and gain experience on routine podiatry because that will now be done(more cheaply) by Pod A's so would it be fair to assume the job /placements for pods will shrink and jobs will be lost leaving only specialist pod vacancies??

    The other obvious point is will a Podiatry Assistant be deemed as doing "Podiatry" at this level and in so doing be lined up for eventual registration with the HPC AND the grandparenting of all the present FHP's?? Can they also use the term Podiatry in their job description?

    Just a few things to get the discussion rolling

  2. R.E.G

    R.E.G Active Member


    Thank you for your support of my position. It was a bit more complicated than your description, but is not everything.

    The issue of the use of scalpels has been debated vigorously both at the Delegates Assembly and Regional Branch Committee level.

    The points you raise and your logic is not unique, however it is not IMO the beliefs of those in the know within the Society. They take the view that as it is the Strategic Health Authority who commission 'Podiatry training' and if they want band 4 Podiatry assistants working independently and using scalpels, then they will get them so the best the Profession can do it engage with defining the role.

    They could be right, I would have hoped for a more aggressive approach.

    The HPC have made their position clear on registration of 'Lesser bods', (no offense I cannot remember their definition) and it is not one of registration but possibly licensing.

    Strange times, without the mass migration of the Grandparented to the Society the views of the PPs within the Society remain subordinate to that of the NHS managers and educators, and the profession remains divided.

    I believe the use of the title Podiatry as in Podiatry Assistant breaches the HPC rules but doubt it will be challenged.

    So I am happy with the provision I supply to my 'clients', the question is will I and my cohort be the last of the hands on Pods.

    Bob Golding
  3. DTT

    DTT Well-Known Member


    I admire ANYONE that has the courage of their conviction and knowing you as I do, I can only imagine how hard it was for you to resign from something you were so involved with for so long.

    Well as you know we both worked very hard to achieve this a few years back, my honest opinion is it wont ever happen not in my time anyway.

    I think that could be a possibility

  4. R.E.G

    R.E.G Active Member


    Just wrote an addition to this post but the rules say I was too late so all my effort was for F**** all. (Learning point never type directly into a thread)

    See if I can remember.

    You say you owe no allegiance to any body except for insurance. I think a few of us have shown that independent insurance id very easy to get, about £140, so continuing using a body is IMO 'support'.

    One of the problems of the grandparented leaving their body (no not tantric flying) was the loss of their certificates of qualification, the qualification apparently belonging to the awarding body not the individual. (Another thing to be challenged?)

    The same happens with the Society but no one can take our diplomas and degrees away.

    Finally some people are of the opinion that the HPC cannot stop you using the protected titles, interesting, and continue to obtain LA.

    So a divided profession not really knowing what is going on and an assortment of bodies not prepared to tell you?

    And Craig thinks that by joining the SCP he will start to understand the UK Podiatry scene.

    The Fees thread was a disgrace.

  5. DTT

    DTT Well-Known Member

    How do you think this if implemented will affect employment for podiatrists in the NHS ??

    Do you think they will drop the educational standard to get the routine done on the cheap ??
    As far as I'm aware the education system allows for 3 levels of qualification, degree, NVQ,and nothing. My gut feeling is Pod 'A's at NVQ level in the future ?
  6. R.E.G

    R.E.G Active Member


    I'm really not that comfortable debating on this forum.

    I have only engaged out of politeness.

    I'm more than happy to continue this subject but feel it would be better and more relevant on Robert I's site Pod Answers.

    If you are happy to go there I will 'register under my own name' on that site.

    Otherwise I feel I have been abused enough by eminent poster and have no interest in going there again.

    Bob Golding.
  7. DTT

    DTT Well-Known Member

  8. Bob

    The SCP are an irrelevance as are the NHS/DoH. In the last 26 years I don't think I have ever felt threatened or intimidated by anyone registered/unregistered in private practice or otherwise. Anyone who does probably suffers unduly from an inferiority complex, which is unfortunate in itself, but not particularly indicative of terminal professional decline. The worst that can be levied at the membership organisations is that they lack vision and collective ambition - and have failed to develop and exploit the podiatric/foot health market for the benefit of their members or their patients.

    However, good clinicians will always be in demand - those with painful intractible foot problems will always seek out those who have the best reputation. It is unfortunate that the membership bodies and the various quangos like the HPC have conspired against professional and clinical development through their incompetance - and vested interests.

    Good to hear your principles won the day, Bob. Are we to hope your balls are big enough for you to do the same to the HPC?

  9. R.E.G

    R.E.G Active Member


    With respect i'm somewhat confused with your post.

    These are the threads I have engaged with related to this subject.



    I do not believe that anyone has ever put forward a rational that convinces me that an extended role for foot care assistants is in the professions interest.

    As I said to Derek, I do not like debating on this forum, nothing to do with the size of my testes or inferiority or fear.

    Just do not like it.

    The offer stands to debate on Pod Answers, a UK centric site. as this is a Uk centric issue.

    Bob Golding

    Ps leaving the HPC I have asked often for info how to do it without loosing all of my privileges, no one responds.

    I have eaten pigs 'balls' far bigger than mine.
  10. Bob

    There have been numerous arguments for and against assistants in podiatry - whether you agree with them or not is about as relevent as the SCP's view. If the NHS decides it wishes to employ monkeys to undertake footcare then it will do so irrespective of your or the Society's opinion. Think about it another way - robotics and engineering advances may well make many operator based podiatric techniques obsolete within a few years - we already have gait analysis software and CAD/CAM manufactured orthoses - I can think of few areas in our scope of practice that can't be mechanised or computerised in some way or another. What relevance would assistants be then? Perhaps we are all destined to become podiatric technicians.

    Whilst I wouldn't envy loose priviledges at any time I can recommend life without the HPC.


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