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Adverse effects of homeopathy

Discussion in 'General Issues and Discussion Forum' started by NewsBot, Feb 12, 2013.

  1. NewsBot

    NewsBot The Admin that posts the news.

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    Adverse effects of homeopathy: a systematic review of published case reports and case series
    P. Posadzki, A. Alotaibi, E. Ernst
    International Journal of Clinical Practice; Volume 66, Issue 12, pages 1178–1188, December 2012
  2. Admin2

    Admin2 Administrator Staff Member

  3. Stanley

    Stanley Well-Known Member

    If there is nothing in the homeopathic remedies except sugar, then what is the mechanism of causing allergic reactions? What are they allergic to?
    Would this be what they call a homeopathic proving?
  4. DAVOhorn

    DAVOhorn Well-Known Member

    I always understood that Homeopathy was sterile deionised water with a dilution of the active ingredient that was so dilute that not even one atom was left. It was the waters memeory that gave the alleged therapeutic benefit.:bash:

    I did not think sugar was used in the dilutions.

    So if people have had a reaction to Homeopathy it could most likely be an adverse reaction to placebo effect.

    So i am even more confused to what goes on with the complimentary therapies as i always believed that they were exclusively Placebo Effect.:craig:

  5. Andrew Ayres

    Andrew Ayres Active Member

    If homeopathy works why dont people fill their cars with water and make them run on the memory of petrol?
  6. Stanley

    Stanley Well-Known Member

    Hi Andy,
    The reason that is stated as to why homeopathy doesn't work is just the fact that you are stating. There is nothing there. I get that part.
    The part I don't get is that there is an allergic reaction.
    Why would a patient get an allergic reaction to nothing?
    My understanding of homeopathy is that the dilution is then sprayed on sugar pellets. But I don't recall of anyone who died from a very small amount of sugar.
    The other interesting thing in this article is that there was one specific homeopathic remedy that caused the majority of problems.
    Also looking at the article, the adverse reactions attributed to these remedies are quite severe like malignant melanoma, parasitaemia or necrosis of the pancreas.
    Could a placebo cause this?:confused:
  7. Nocebo.
  8. Stanley

    Stanley Well-Known Member

    Hi Dr. Spooner,
    Thanks for your reply. I had considered Nocebo, but quickly rejected it.
    Since you read my post before you answered, I am sure that you noticed that one patient developed parasitaemia.
    That is called spontaneous generation:

    I don't believe in spontaneous generation, but I am surprised that you do.
    Could you show me some studies that support your position?

  9. I was answering your question that you had asked a couple of times:
    Answer: nocebo effect. I saw that placebo effect had been mentioned, but not nocebo effect- these are not the same and I would not "quickly reject" the nocebo effect in terms of "allergic reactions" observed in response to homeopathy as you have done.

    I was not answering your latter questions regarding parasitaemia, but since you've asked:

    You can't develop parasitaemia unless you've got a parasite infestation. Pararasites clearly can't come from homeopathy unless a homeopathic solution/ pill contains parasites and/ or eggs- perhaps in this case the homepathic solution did and they even put it straight into their blood-stream (what was the parasite in question?), who knows? Or, if the individual used a homeopathic preparation to "treat" an existing parasite infection.

    In other words, you can loose your straw-man argument trying to suggest that I somehow believe in spontaneous generation, Stanley. I'm guessing you know where I think you can put that along with the homeopathic pills, for all the good they'll do you.

    Talking of pil: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylOCIP54PIQ
  10. Deborah Ferguson

    Deborah Ferguson Active Member


    I've heard of people using homeopathic preparations for malaria prophylaxis ( on the advice of a homeopath !!) rather than conventional antimalarials such as Chloroquine so I guess if the individual develops acute malaria this counts as an`adverse effect`.


  11. Cross-posting. Agreed.
  12. horseman

    horseman Active Member

    which is now so expesive I only have a memory of being able to afford a full tank:boohoo:
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2013
  13. Because if you forgot to fill up, the amount of petrol would become smaller and thus more powerful, eventually blowing up your engine when it reached the octane level of jet fuel.
  14. Stanley

    Stanley Well-Known Member

    Dr. Spooner and Dr. Ferguson,
    Thanks for the explanation as to how parasitaemia can be an adverse reaction to homeopathic remedies.
    As a result I looked further into it, and you were correct.


  15. Deborah Ferguson

    Deborah Ferguson Active Member

    Hi Stanley

    Think I've been mistakenly elevated - it's Deborah not Doctor

  16. CPedTechie

    CPedTechie Member

  17. David Wedemeyer

    David Wedemeyer Well-Known Member

    Stanley it is not merely sugar but dilute quantites of agents many of us have probably never heard of, manufactured by people we've probably never heard of and possibly in countries we'd never visit. ;)
  18. Stanley

    Stanley Well-Known Member

    Hi David,

    Now I am confused. :confused:
    That was my original thought as to why there were adverse reactions.
    The consensus seems to be that there is nothing in these remedies, so the adverse affects are due to the nocebo effect.
    Dr. Spooner is more versed than me on the nocebo effect.
    However, being a chiropractor, you may know other chiropractors that use them and have a better first hand knowlege about how well it works or doesn't (placebo or nocebo).
    I looked at the article, and some of these substances I do know (like Thuja [that is a plant that is in front of my office], Echinacea [ the purple coneflower], Cuprum metallicum [sounds like Copper], Arsenicum sulfuratum [sounds like Arsenic sulfate or sulfide], but most I don't (like ledum or Rhus Toxicodendron and a whole host of others)
    I started to look some of them up.
    Rhus toxicodendron is Poison Ivy,http://www.healthline.com/galecontent/rhus-toxicodendron and a mother tincture is the plant soaked in alcohol http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Mother tincture
    The article shows the adverse effect being wide spread dermatitis and leukocytosis. If a patient ingested poison ivy, I wouldn't be too surprised to see this side effect, so you may be right. :confused:

  19. W J Liggins

    W J Liggins Well-Known Member

    My understanding is that in mainland Europe homeopathic practitioners use various dilute herbal and other 'treatments' in addition to the 'remedies' ie. nonsense dilutions, understood as homeopathy in the UK and the US, hence the malaria noted above.

    Just off to have a large glass of water with one tiny drop of St.Emilion - by gum, does it taste good!

  20. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

  21. akn102

    akn102 Active Member

    An interesting study but my thoughts are:

    This was a very small study
    We need comparative studies of looking at success claims of homeopathy
    We need to maintain an open mind;

    Science is fluid and ever-evolving, it this were not the case we'd still be carrying out the same treatments as they were 100 years ago - with that in mind we should remember that new evidence may come to light and it is surely unscientific to simply disregard something because it doesn't fit our current mould of what we subjectively believe is 'good' science......

    A while ago people completely disregarded herbs as medicinal treatment. Yet, if herbs have no effect whatsoever, how is that St johns wort, for example, is cited as blocking the effects of certain pharmeuticals....
  22. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    It was not a study. It was a higher level systematic review
    There have been plenty of them. they all showed it does not work
    You are confusing "herbs" and "homeopathy".

    Homeopathy is a fraud and a scam. It is physiologically impossible for homeopathy to work. Anyone with an 'open mind' can see that.

    Now that it is clear that homeopathy is no better than water, the scammers and fraudsters are trying to change the 'rules of science' and say that it does not apply to homeopathy.

    Just this AM, there was this etry in the Encyclopedia of American Loons:

    If anyone is helped with homeopathy, then the affect was purely an expensive placebo.
  23. horseman

    horseman Active Member

    If anyone is helped with homeopathy, then the affect was purely an expensive placebo.[/QUOTE]

    Don't dismiss the placebo, look at the work at the Radcliffe on pain relief...:dizzy:
  24. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    I would never dismiss the placebo effect - its powerful.

    I just object to homeopathy charging a lot of money for water. That is fraud and dishonest.

    Here is my daughter testifying just how powerful the placebo is:

    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2016

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