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Orthotics bad - another Doctor 'chiro'

Discussion in 'Biomechanics, Sports and Foot orthoses' started by Tin, Mar 15, 2012.

  1. Tin

    Tin Active Member

  2. David Wedemeyer

    David Wedemeyer Well-Known Member

    Just a "bit"? It makes me wonder if he recommends diabetics go barefoot as well?

    He is partnered with this site, so I'm not surprised he makes the claims that he does; with absolutely zero evidence:

  3. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    One of the problems with the "internet" is you can say want you want and not be accountable.

    People who make these sorts of claims are going to have to start explaining why every single outcome study has shown foot orthotics work. Not one outcome study has shown they don't. Have you noticed that those who make claims like the above never address the evidence?
  4. BEN-HUR

    BEN-HUR Well-Known Member

    What should we expect from a site that promotes such moronic reasoning...
    Chimps don’t wear thick, over-supportive shoes and neither should you! - you can even wear the T-shirt :eek:. (Putting aside the comparative anatomy/physiology/biomechanics of the primate - human foot/lower limb)... whilst on this line of reasoning; can someone show me chimps who make a cognitive decision to run a desired distance each day, reach potential training loads of anywhere between 50 - 200km a week & compete in marathons. Hence the premise is moronic as well as the analogy (yet I suspect why it was made :deadhorse:).

    Must admit, I do believe (in part) one aspect of the material - the potential consequences of "thick, over-supportive shoes" for some people. Yet this issue is a multifaceted topic that should not invoke generalised assumptions for humans.
  5. Tin

    Tin Active Member

    This guy does have one up on us - he is good at getting content on his site and people to look at him. BAN orthotics? I wish I could swear on this forum. He angers me with his fanatical and cult like approach. Do you see monkeys in shopping centres or working on concrete floors? Moron. Suggesting that we should model ourselves on chimps...I think this is the opposite of evolution.
  6. Tin

    Tin Active Member

    Your comment is awaiting moderation.

    So, looking at your profile, you obviously either A-are looking for attention and publicity OR B -are fanatical and clinically narrow minded…i mean not wearing shoes? Fair enough if home and work was in a jungle for you…but it ain’t.

    I appreciate the bare foot running model and support it…but this is only applicable to RUNNING. Where you have a ‘flight’ phase of gait and heel strike according to this theory should be avoided through training. WALKING gait DOES have an inevitable heel strike phase of gait. Your technical mumbo jumbo CAN be interpreted by other medical professionals and some of your claims are radical and completely false, one might even say fitting for a CULT.

    Brings me to my main point…you claim orthotics to be ‘unnatural’: WELL, did you ever think about the completely flat and non forgiving surfaces or weight bearing environment you walk on? I’d back bare feet all the way if we were all walking on sand, turf, gravel, dirt etc.

    Orthotics have a funciton and DO treat symptoms and the CAUSE of problems. NO they do not work for every patient and when clinically prescribed in the right manner – THEY DO WORK. I don’t knock your profession and treating modalities and ‘wage war’ with braveheart facepaint as it is not professional. Do what you do best for your patients and let evidence based medicine look after the rest. Let me see the stats facts and studies before you degrade without evidence the practices of other professionals. In other countries, a degree in ‘chiropractics’ does not respectfully warrant the title of ‘Doctor’. But you don’t see me waging war on that matter…

    My Bottom line – - – - – -

    Every treatment has it’s pros and cons. The more general you are (as with those psychic readings), the greater your chances of hitting the nail on the head. The more specific you are (target the foot only with orthotics), the easier you can miss if you clinically prescribe incorrectly. Get it right however, and it works in harmony with the body.

    Orthotics for Running and sports need to be tailored to the individual. I DO support the barefoot running model…in some cases AND the runner’s gait needs to be RETRAINED to suit it.

    Orthotics for everyday activities and WALKING – I believe are very practical and clinically significant in relieving symptoms and improving the HOLISTIC treatment of a patient in their posture and gait.

    Holistic approach, diet control, etc. GOOD! Well done on that and I’m sure you have improved the lives of your patients….but worry about what you do, and not what others do.

    Let me ask you honestly though, do you have a stake in a minimalistic shoe/shoe product? I’m put on money on it.

    Post this post up if you allow me to speak my mind! I dare ya!


  7. DaVinci

    DaVinci Well-Known Member

    Never let the facts and evidence get in the way of an irrational rant.

    I wonder how he treats posterior tibial tendon dysfunction?
  8. I'm sure something like heel raises should fix everything according to this guy. That is what is really scary about the internet these days...anybody can write something with absolutely no evidence (or from poor sources) and actually convince the masses. The funny thing about the holistic approach to medicine to my mind is that most of the time, the health profession (chiro,physio) tells the patient to do certain exercises at home certain times a day and eat a very strict schedule but you know what?....alot of patients stop doing the exercises and as a result their pain doesn't improve. Thats one of the pro's about orthotics is that they do they work for the patient.
    Also, I love how he promotes the correct toes...he probably has a stake in that too along with miniminalist footwear.

    Chirpractors are great at what they do...the spine, however i really wish they would stop preaching that they are the superior force in most medicine. Lets just stick to our own scope of practice and let other areas of medicine do the same, we have to all work together and use one another for the betterment of the patients.
    I live in Ontario, Canada and there is a reason why chiropractors aren't allowed to dispense orthotics by the majority of insurance companies.
  9. David Wedemeyer

    David Wedemeyer Well-Known Member



    You hit on one very important area that is difficult to monitor in an out patient setting; compliance.

    I know Tim is frustrated and I share his frustration but let's not forget that we see this type of behavior in every allied profession. That said, I feel it is unethical to completely denigrate the work of other professions, especially for self-promotion.

    Great response Tin but please consider easing up on the part about professional designation. Podiatrists in other countries don't have quite the same title or scope that they do in the U.S., the same with DC's.

    In my state some of what this DC is writing may be considered unprofessional behavior. Failure to refer is one area where a guy like this lands himself in hot water. Another potential problem is stepping over professional boundaries, which he is clearing promoting on his blog.
  10. pauline hill

    pauline hill Welcome New Poster

    This message is not new to me. I work in a Chiropractic Centre where until eighteen months ago my work on biomechanics and orthotics was welcomed, encouraged and where I had many referrals from the Chiros. In fact it was the reason I was asked to start a surgery there.

    However, all has changed now. The main Chiropractor also sings from the same hymn sheet as this guy, with one major exception. He doesn't cure absolutely everything via the muscle system - he does it by releasing the adhesions down the centre of the spinal column and thereby allowing the nervous system to do its work.

    This is an American form of Chiropractic called ABC. A patient has to attend for treatment twice a week for two months, then it reduces to once a week and so on. This costs a fortune, but not to worry... it cures everything. You can throw away your orthotics, not bother with physio or massage, just spend your money with this Chiro and your life will be transformed! Obviously he no longer refers patients to me!

    He also wanders around in barefoot shoes and promotes them to his patients. More income!

    Many of my patients who were told to remove their orthotics, have now put them back, and no longer attend for chiropractic treatment.

    In my opinion both my Chiropractor and this Doctor 'Chiro' are both full of unsubstantiated egotistical and dangerous facts, and are out to make as much money of out it as they can.

    Meanwhile... I am moving my clinic!!
  11. mgooch

    mgooch Member

    Even better is that in the comments section he says that these are the only insoles that he could recommend:


    With a name like barefootscience... they have to be good right?
  12. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator


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