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Dartfish digital video analysis software

Discussion in 'Biomechanics, Sports and Foot orthoses' started by Kenva, Oct 12, 2006.

  1. Kenva

    Kenva Active Member

  2. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    I have used a number of these types of programs and at the end of the day, there was not a lot of difference between them. They all gave me the information that I wanted.

    I have only used Dartfish to trial it and it seemed ok. We use Silicon Coch (have a publication coming up in JAPMA in which we used it). There was also this thread on the use of these technologies in practice: Digital video and pressure mapping in Private Practice
  3. David Smith

    David Smith Well-Known Member

    Kenva and Craig

    I was wondering how people use this video software technology and for what purpose.

    Dave Smith
  4. Ian Lenehan

    Ian Lenehan Welcome New Poster

    Hi Ken
    check out currex.de , enjoy .
  5. fred

    fred Member

    hi ken,

    I attended a demonstration of Dartfish

    it is perfect to communicate with the prescribers, that made very serious because the analyses are beautiful
    it is a good software but I find his price very high

    moreover, its exploitation is long, rather difficult

    I think that it is a software for the schools which have time and money but not for a use as private customers

    if you want more information, friend Belgian uses it, I can give you his mail by private message (is it possible in French ?)
  6. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    Gait analysis. It plays a role in decision making for what position I cast the first ray in or if first ray cut out is used. It also help decides if want to use an asymmetrical density heel posts or raises.

    ie it can change my orthotic prescription

  7. GBK

    GBK Welcome New Poster

    Gait Analysis:

    Has anyone seen or use Templo video analysis software?

  8. LCBL

    LCBL Active Member

    Ive been looking at video analysis software for my clinic for about a year now. I asked myself what value does gait analysis software offers me and my patients. There are systems that are just glorified 'front end' and some are very sofisticated but are overkill for my needs. I am not looking for a 'research' model but a software package that aids my assessment and ultimately my prescription then that gives my patients value for money.

    I narrowed my search to Dartfish, SiliconCoach, Quintic and TEMPLO. With my need for a reporting package that can be customised and be presented to the patient that is part of a strong analysis package I have gone for the TEMPLO system.

    You can see that on www.currex.de and I am getting it through www.mar-systems.co.uk The guy that runs Mar-Systems, Jonathan, is very helpful and eager to assist.

    Good luck.
  9. Kenva

    Kenva Active Member

    We are looking for something to use in our clinical gait lab. We already used the 2D kinematic software for:
    - the comparison of different kind of braces and their effect on de everion motion of the calcaneum
    - comparison of the effect of classic Root orthotic and the MHS on calcaneal motion
    - ...

    It can give some extra information (quantitative) on the angles you are seeing.
    Since the FO is a device that alters the temporal patterns of forces acting on the foot to allow more 'normal' gait and to lower pathological tissue stress, the extra soft- and hardware can help the students to get to the level that ,instead of looking for a foot functioning around a NCSP, they can look at range of motion actually used before and after (during) orthotic therapy. same as the use of plantar pressure systems (RS scan) where you can see CoP vs STJ axis,...
    I think there has to be something in return to check if an orthotic is 'working' or not. The use of 2D kinematic software has it's limitations, but clinically, it's good to work with...it helps with the orthotic prescription.

  10. David Smith

    David Smith Well-Known Member


    Can a 2D video give extra information? Or is it the same information but with perhaps a more accurate definition achieved since with slo-mo and zoom and repeatability the measurements can be more precise. What are these measurements though? Are they a reliable characterisation of the motion of the joint of interest? Or are they a more precise recording of bogus data.
    Assume one films the subject pre and post intervention and lets assume the recording is from the same reference point and the STJ is the joint of interest. Measurement pre intervention of the RoM is + 2dgs to –7dgs thru stance phase. Post intervention is
    +4 to – 4dgs. However post intervention the foot was 10dgs less toe out than pre intervention. How does this internal rotation of the foot affect the rear-foot RoM measurements. People often make the assumption that what you see is what you get but more often than not quite the opposite is true and what you see is an illusion.

    Perhaps one could look at the gait as a whole, wouldn’t this give a clear overall picture about changes in gait style. Certainly it would show changes but to say what, how or why those changes occurred and what is the effect in terms of outcome and pathology might be quite difficult and open to contradiction.
    For instance looking at the knee from the front view it might appear that the valgus knee has become less Valgus ie straighter. Is it? Or is the hip more externally rotated. Perhaps both have occurred but has it changed the magnitude of pathological moments about the knee in the frontal plane? Possibly not since as the knee externally rotates the CoP moves to the lateral foot and the moment arm causing frontal plane rotation about the knee remains the same length.

    What reference frame does one use for filming? Do you use exact global axes or some oblique axis, how would one decide? Is it then possible to make intuitive and reliable qualitative or quantitative estimates about temporal spatial changes in terms of whatever axis frame was chosen.

    It would seem to me that 2D video has some uses as a recording, reporting and rough comparative tool but the limitations are huge and must be recognised before relying on the data output.

    Having said all that and having only used video in the lab for the purpose of finding its limitations and never used 2D video to assess a patient it seems quite possible but equally puzzling that clinicians can and do use this technology to improve clinical outcomes???

    Or does it improve their confidence in the outcome, since they have an video recording with all the software features to impress the patient.
    The clinician has more confidence so then does the patient and so the outcome improves.

    Cheers Dave Smith
  11. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    It always astouds me how more willing patients are prepared to hand over $ after a showing them a video of their gait :eek:

    To me, ethically (and we discussed this in another thread) we should only be using any assessment tool if the use if that tool has the potential to change the treatment. With a digital video of the gait, would you still use the same intervention (ie orthotic prescription) without the video. For me, until recently, the answer would have been yes, so the video only really served as a marketing exercise (some might prefer the words 'patient education').

    We now know that the angles etc, how much the foot pronates etc etc do not really tell us anything except what the angle is (and what do we actually do with that angle anyway?) --- they have nothing to do with altering outcomes.

    Now that we learnt more, there are things that can only be seen in slow mo (ie the transfer from BM's low gear to high gear; and the symmetry of heel off) that can and do lead to an alteration in the casting position and the orthotic prescription ..... but they are all done in the contect of the problematic nature of 2D and the sampling rate of digital video.


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